I'm in a class called healthy lifestyles and we're talking about healthcare around the world. I'm 21, I'm under my parents insurance still since i'm still in college and was really really naive about this issue. This class has really opened my eyes about how much the US healthcare system SUCKS. We watched most of Michael Moore's "Sicko" in class..and I dont know if you've seen it or not but there was one man who was working and accidently sawed off the tips of 2 fingers, his middle and his ring finger. To reattach the middle finger would cost $60,000 and to attach the ring finger was 12,000. Given the financial situation they were in his wife and he could only have the ring finger reattached. Basically same story happens in Great Britain, guy saws off all 4 fingers...goes to the hospital and has all of them reattached and there is no bill issued due to their health care policy.
This ridiculous! In London the Doctors are paid bonuses based on how many patients they DONT see...meaning their patients stay healthy, here in the United States, the more money these doctors save by denying treatment, the more money the insurance companies save, so they get a bonus basically by NOT doing their job! This is INSANE! All the power is in the insurance companies and I think thats a huge problem...I was never worried about health care(probably since Im under my parents) but something needs to be done here.
I was nearly in tears when the woman was telling her story of how her husband had cancer. They needed a donor for bone marrow, found a perfect match in his little brother and hoped his life could be saved. Well, turns out their insurance company considered this proceedure "experimental" and refused to cover it. Imagine being in that situation...having a loved one fight cancer, finding a possible solution and having your heart ripped out because you cant afford it and your insurance wont cover it. I cant imagine being in this situation

so anyway, i'm done ranting..i just wanna know how some of you feel about health care where you're from...and if you're from the US what do you think needs to be done here???
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replied September 27th, 2008
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That's why I'm voting for Obama!! McCain won't do anything for this horrible healthcare situation in america.
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replied September 27th, 2008
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i'm so glad i live in canada. we don't have a perfect system but at least we have something. when i go to the emergency room or for a check up or when i had my baby, i never once had to worry about paying for anything. if my baby is sick, the doctor will see her the same day and there is no worry about a bill because everything's been paid for. we may pay more taxes than other places, i don't really know, but i do know that those taxes pay for our healthcare when we need it. a person with cancer or some other life threatening illness shouldn't have to worry about how they are going to pay so they can fight for their life. a wealthy person's life shouldn't be more valuable than someone who is poor. hospitals shouldn't be all about profiting off sick people. i love how micheal moore puts it in Sicko, if your house was burning down, you wouldn't hesitate to call 911 because you know the firemen are there to help you. they won't show up and hand you a bill for putting the fire out. why isn't healthcare just as important?
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replied September 27th, 2008
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My "health insurance" right now consists of two things: 1. I save up money to pay out of pocket for check ups. 2. I go to the ER at our large metropolitan teaching hospital that has a system in place of charging you based on your income.

Right now I have a gaping hole in a wisdom tooth that broke early this summer. The crappy health insurance I was on would only pay for tooth removal if there was an accident that occurred that caused the damage, and then only 60%. I asked the insurance agent over the phone if she were a dentist (because she was asking me the circumstances of how my tooth broke) and when she said no I hung up.

I have a new job lined up and they utilize something called health insurance savings account. I am not really up and up on the details, but it sounds like I put money in an account every pay period, which can then be used towards any service. When I get up to $2000 in bills (which would have to be paid out of pocket) only then can I use the savings account. After some point (not sure, sorry) then the insurance saving company pays 80% of costs and I pay 20%. Of course, that would all have to be approved by them. Viagra for men is covered, birth control for women is not.

There is more money in making sure people don't receive treatment than making sure they do.

I hope things get changed. I can't imagine having a family and kids and worrying about all this.
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replied September 27th, 2008
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Yes killbill you are lucky. And I wish it was like that in america. I wouldn't mind paying more taxes to get this benefit. Right now well I don't have health insurance issues because I work in a company with medical benefits but it frightens me the thought of loosing my job and then getting sick and then what I will do.
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replied September 29th, 2008
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nightangel73 wrote:
Yes killbill you are lucky. And I wish it was like that in america. I wouldn't mind paying more taxes to get this benefit. Right now well I don't have health insurance issues because I work in a company with medical benefits but it frightens me the thought of loosing my job and then getting sick and then what I will do.


exactly and thats what sucks....

killbill, I remember the part in the movie where michael more was talking about the police and firemen, i liked that part as well...idk if our society right now would be ok with increasing taxes for health benefits such as in canada but something definitely needs to be done...i think theres another system, i forget where...where 15 or 20% of what you make comes out of your paycheck and goes towards healthcare, obviously if you make more you're gonna have to donate more..but I think thats a pretty fair system

I cannot believe Viagra is approved but birth control isn't!!!! thats ridiculous
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replied September 29th, 2008
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And think about what we will do after retirement. Medicare is threathened with the increasing number of people with Alzheimer, it's going to wipe them out.
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replied October 3rd, 2008
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First world countries.. Bliss..
I live in a third world country (whoopee) where you have to have health insurance or you’re stuffed. You can only go to a private hospital if you have health insurance or if you are stinking rich – in which case you can afford medical insurance anyway.
The news papers here are stuffed with reports of people dying on the floors! of the hospitals, defenseless senior citizen being raped in their hospital beds, and recently there was an article in a magazine of a lady who dropped her elderly mother of at a state hospital because she had a migraine and now she’s paralyzed for life. Yip, head hurts, spine damaged.
Medical insurance for me and one dependant – R 3100.00 per month and I earn R120 000.00 per year. (premiums are not calculated by income) Entry level positions (skilled) pays about R4000.00 – R6000.00 per month. Most unskilled workers only earn R 900.00 per month, and they are the ones who live in shacks with no running water – forget about sanitary systems.
DO NOT COMPLAIN! protest
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replied October 11th, 2008
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Beline, I am touched by your stories. They are truly awful. But you cannot ask people who see obvious criminal activity occuring under the guise of a system originally designed to help people not to complain about it. The higher ups of insurance companies are multi-millionaires. Even someof us who could pay for basic menial coverage often find themselves denied that because once in 1992 I had a migraine or my husband had a normal lumbar MRI and the insurance company got nervous and denied him coverage. My sister can't get coverage for her two asthmatic children if she leaves her job, and they require routine medication. I hate the fear that comes with sickness. When your health is in jeopardy the first thing that comes to mind is not "How will I get better?" but "How will I pay for this?" I think all people in all countries deserve basic health care at no charge. Extra stuff like lap band surgery, cosmetic surgery, etc is one thing, but basic coverage should be a basic human right. I guess that's why we continue to compain.
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replied October 12th, 2008
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Sorry, Sillyakchick. Embarassed You’re right. I guess I’m really worked up about this issue because a co-worker of my fiancé passed away about a day or two before this topic was posted. She died because of a state hospital’s gross negligence. Everybody deserves proper medical assistance when they need it. Not only the super-rich.
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replied October 12th, 2008
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We have free healthcare here but it's not perfect. Just recently a friend of my aunt's had gallbladder surgery. It was a day surgery so she was released right away. A couple of days later she had a really sore stomach so she went to the urgent care (emergency) and told the triage nurse what was going on. She could barely stand up straight because she was in so much pain. The nurse told her not to be so melodramatic because it wouldn't get her seen by a doctor any sooner. Well, by the time they did see her it was too late. She died of an infection in her abdomen the next day. It could have been treated if she hadn't had to wait for so long.

Another man who was in a wheelchair with diabetes recently died in the emergency room after sitting there for 35 hours. They just ignored him and he died in his wheelchair. Another person waiting reported it to the nurse and to security but they didn't do anything.
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replied October 13th, 2008
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killbill wrote:
We have free healthcare here but it's not perfect. Just recently a friend of my aunt's had gallbladder surgery. It was a day surgery so she was released right away. A couple of days later she had a really sore stomach so she went to the urgent care (emergency) and told the triage nurse what was going on. She could barely stand up straight because she was in so much pain. The nurse told her not to be so melodramatic because it wouldn't get her seen by a doctor any sooner. Well, by the time they did see her it was too late. She died of an infection in her abdomen the next day. It could have been treated if she hadn't had to wait for so long.

Another man who was in a wheelchair with diabetes recently died in the emergency room after sitting there for 35 hours. They just ignored him and he died in his wheelchair. Another person waiting reported it to the nurse and to security but they didn't do anything.


these stories are horrible! something needs to be done this is ridiculous
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replied October 13th, 2008
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Oh I could so rant about this subject.....

When I was in labour, they told me I wasn't having contractions, the machine didnt pick them up, so they sent me home. Half way home, we drove back and I had Cam in less than an hour but think about it if I was at home, baby would have been born at home and like Killbill I was told I was exagerating or being melodramatic.

I think our system isn't any better, drs are overworked and I think we should have a system more like britain, meaning make sure people are treated the best so they dont come back, Educate them!
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replied October 13th, 2008
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Yup, the key is covering preventative services, legislating against unhealthy food like fast food (yes I know that is extreme), more benefits if you exercise and don't smoke, more emphasis on healthy living all around.

But none of that makes anyone any money, except maybe gyms.
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replied October 14th, 2008
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Birch wrote:
Yup, the key is covering preventative services, legislating against unhealthy food like fast food (yes I know that is extreme), more benefits if you exercise and don't smoke, more emphasis on healthy living all around.

But none of that makes anyone any money, except maybe gyms.


sounds like a great plan to me...and it actually aims at improving peoples health...as you said, the key is PREVENTATIVE care...but the thing is, some people cant afford that and end up going in for crisis care and running up a massive medical bill...ugh, i DREAD getting my own insurance..lucky for my family my moms job has provided some decent benefits..not without a nice dent in the paycheck of course but..what can you do...i got about a year and a half left and apparently at 23 i'm kicked off of the insurance regardless of whether i'm out of school and have a full time job or not...
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replied October 14th, 2008
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In South Africa we have a numerous medical aids schemes you can choose from. The best known one gives you quite a bit of discount if you go to a specific gym group (they’re all over the country) on a regular basis. You get a swipe card which you swipe when entering the gym and of course you swipe it again when you leave. Your discount at the medical insurance company is calculated by the number of hours you spend exercising.
I think it’s a great idea. The healthier people are the less money the insurance companies have to cough up when you’re sick.
And of course the clients benefit with the discount and of course they get the much needed exercise.
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replied October 16th, 2008
Experienced User
Re: Healthcare
worrywart01 wrote:
I'm in a class called healthy lifestyles and we're talking about healthcare around the world. I'm 21, I'm under my parents insurance still since i'm still in college and was really really naive about this issue. This class has really opened my eyes about how much the US healthcare system SUCKS. We watched most of Michael Moore's "Sicko" in class..and I dont know if you've seen it or not but there was one man who was working and accidently sawed off the tips of 2 fingers, his middle and his ring finger. To reattach the middle finger would cost $60,000 and to attach the ring finger was 12,000. Given the financial situation they were in his wife and he could only have the ring finger reattached. Basically same story happens in Great Britain, guy saws off all 4 fingers...goes to the hospital and has all of them reattached and there is no bill issued due to their health care policy.
This ridiculous! In London the Doctors are paid bonuses based on how many patients they DONT see...meaning their patients stay healthy, here in the United States, the more money these doctors save by denying treatment, the more money the insurance companies save, so they get a bonus basically by NOT doing their job! This is INSANE! All the power is in the insurance companies and I think thats a huge problem...I was never worried about health care(probably since Im under my parents) but something needs to be done here.
I was nearly in tears when the woman was telling her story of how her husband had cancer. They needed a donor for bone marrow, found a perfect match in his little brother and hoped his life could be saved. Well, turns out their insurance company considered this proceedure "experimental" and refused to cover it. Imagine being in that situation...having a loved one fight cancer, finding a possible solution and having your heart ripped out because you cant afford it and your insurance wont cover it. I cant imagine being in this situation

so anyway, i'm done ranting..i just wanna know how some of you feel about health care where you're from...and if you're from the US what do you think needs to be done here???


Christ...they are showing Michael Moore movies in class? I can't believe what some of these nutty far-left professors will stoop to. Michael Moore preys on the weak minded to further his nonsense. He's been doing it for almost 20 years now.

No....Universal health care does not work and it's because of what KillBill said - the delays. You will wait for everything...Just had a heart attack? Sry, you'll have to wait for treatment. Had stroke? Have to wait. Oh, you have cancer, do you? Gonna have to wait months for treatment while that sucker spreads.

As far as healthcare in England is concerned. If people are so satisfied with their universal health care there, then why does privatiezed health care keep growing at an alarming rate?

And Cuba? There's no denying cuba's life expectancy (which is still lower than the U.S.), but to survey the people of a communist nation, where thoughts are controlled, are a bad idea. And indicatior is the hundreds of Cuban doctors that keep migrating to the U.S.

Come on, man. You are 21, do some research on your own!
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replied October 16th, 2008
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Re: Healthcare
wrote:
worrywart01 wrote:
I'm in a class called healthy lifestyles and we're talking about healthcare around the world. I'm 21, I'm under my parents insurance still since i'm still in college and was really really naive about this issue. This class has really opened my eyes about how much the US healthcare system SUCKS. We watched most of Michael Moore's "Sicko" in class..and I dont know if you've seen it or not but there was one man who was working and accidently sawed off the tips of 2 fingers, his middle and his ring finger. To reattach the middle finger would cost $60,000 and to attach the ring finger was 12,000. Given the financial situation they were in his wife and he could only have the ring finger reattached. Basically same story happens in Great Britain, guy saws off all 4 fingers...goes to the hospital and has all of them reattached and there is no bill issued due to their health care policy.
This ridiculous! In London the Doctors are paid bonuses based on how many patients they DONT see...meaning their patients stay healthy, here in the United States, the more money these doctors save by denying treatment, the more money the insurance companies save, so they get a bonus basically by NOT doing their job! This is INSANE! All the power is in the insurance companies and I think thats a huge problem...I was never worried about health care(probably since Im under my parents) but something needs to be done here.
I was nearly in tears when the woman was telling her story of how her husband had cancer. They needed a donor for bone marrow, found a perfect match in his little brother and hoped his life could be saved. Well, turns out their insurance company considered this proceedure "experimental" and refused to cover it. Imagine being in that situation...having a loved one fight cancer, finding a possible solution and having your heart ripped out because you cant afford it and your insurance wont cover it. I cant imagine being in this situation

so anyway, i'm done ranting..i just wanna know how some of you feel about health care where you're from...and if you're from the US what do you think needs to be done here???


Christ...they are showing Michael Moore movies in class? I can't believe what some of these nutty far-left professors will stoop to. Michael Moore preys on the weak minded to further his nonsense. He's been doing it for almost 20 years now.

No....Universal health care does not work and it's because of what KillBill said - the delays. You will wait for everything...Just had a heart attack? Sry, you'll have to wait for treatment. Had stroke? Have to wait. Oh, you have cancer, do you? Gonna have to wait months for treatment while that sucker spreads.

As far as healthcare in England is concerned. If people are so satisfied with their universal health care there, then why does privatiezed health care keep growing at an alarming rate?

And Cuba? There's no denying cuba's life expectancy (which is still lower than the U.S.), but to survey the people of a communist nation, where thoughts are controlled, are a bad idea. And indicatior is the hundreds of Cuban doctors that keep migrating to the U.S.

Come on, man. You are 21, do some research on your own!


The examples I mentioned are rare exceptions, one of which made national headlines and prompted our regional health authority to look at the problem and address it. Personally, I think they were both cases of racism more than anything. You can't have a perfect system when you have imperfect human beings running and using it. I don't know of anyone who has had to wait while they die of cancer but I know of a lot of people who have had cancer and haven't left their family with tens of thousands of dollars in medical bills. I live in Canada and I would not want to live in the states. I don't think any system is perfect but I prefer one that is based on need, not on profit.
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replied October 16th, 2008
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I don't think "Sicko" is the best place to get your information on health care systems. It's nice to "supplement" any information, but I hope no one is getting all of their information there.

That being said: I don't like socialized health care. It fosters a society that runs to the doctor for everything because they can, and there is not competitive rates for doctors.

1) People can't go to the doctor for everyhting. If you've got a cold, get rest, take the medicine you would otherwise take/herbal supplements, and only if things get worse...go over there. I'm not saying people should wait until things get horrible to go to the doctor. Instead, I'm advocating that one lets his/herr body work itself out before he/she runs for medications that will lose it's effectiveness the more you get it.

2) WE NEED DOCTORS. If a these doctors are not paid an amount that is competitive, we will lose doctors. I don't care what Moore says in his movie...he can look all over England and find at least one doctor who feels comfortable in his wages. He neglected to say anything about how there is a private practice of dentists in the UK; more dentists are moving over to the private sector because they can be paid a competitive amount rather than the general salary provided by the government. Along with the less competitive pays, we get less doctors. Who would want to go through school, paying thousands upon thousands of dollars, and then go into a profession that will demand you to spend DECADES to pay off your debt? I'm sorry, but I am more than willing to spend as much money as possible to get the best care. At least, as long as I can afford...which brings me to my last point...

There should be a universal health insurance program instead of universal health care. Yay for that! Helath insurance that provides coverage for preventative care (already discussed) and one that has pre-tax debti cards that can be used for ANY medical service. Birch, that is a horrible system to put upon people. Giving people a tax break that would allow you to purchase your own plan, right for you is what you and all other Americans need.

Just my two cents. Health care is a sticky thing...
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replied October 16th, 2008
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Re: Healthcare
wrote:
worrywart01 wrote:
I'm in a class called healthy lifestyles and we're talking about healthcare around the world. I'm 21, I'm under my parents insurance still since i'm still in college and was really really naive about this issue. This class has really opened my eyes about how much the US healthcare system SUCKS. We watched most of Michael Moore's "Sicko" in class..and I dont know if you've seen it or not but there was one man who was working and accidently sawed off the tips of 2 fingers, his middle and his ring finger. To reattach the middle finger would cost $60,000 and to attach the ring finger was 12,000. Given the financial situation they were in his wife and he could only have the ring finger reattached. Basically same story happens in Great Britain, guy saws off all 4 fingers...goes to the hospital and has all of them reattached and there is no bill issued due to their health care policy.
This ridiculous! In London the Doctors are paid bonuses based on how many patients they DONT see...meaning their patients stay healthy, here in the United States, the more money these doctors save by denying treatment, the more money the insurance companies save, so they get a bonus basically by NOT doing their job! This is INSANE! All the power is in the insurance companies and I think thats a huge problem...I was never worried about health care(probably since Im under my parents) but something needs to be done here.
I was nearly in tears when the woman was telling her story of how her husband had cancer. They needed a donor for bone marrow, found a perfect match in his little brother and hoped his life could be saved. Well, turns out their insurance company considered this proceedure "experimental" and refused to cover it. Imagine being in that situation...having a loved one fight cancer, finding a possible solution and having your heart ripped out because you cant afford it and your insurance wont cover it. I cant imagine being in this situation

so anyway, i'm done ranting..i just wanna know how some of you feel about health care where you're from...and if you're from the US what do you think needs to be done here???


Christ...they are showing Michael Moore movies in class? I can't believe what some of these nutty far-left professors will stoop to. Michael Moore preys on the weak minded to further his nonsense. He's been doing it for almost 20 years now.

No....Universal health care does not work and it's because of what KillBill said - the delays. You will wait for everything...Just had a heart attack? Sry, you'll have to wait for treatment. Had stroke? Have to wait. Oh, you have cancer, do you? Gonna have to wait months for treatment while that sucker spreads.

As far as healthcare in England is concerned. If people are so satisfied with their universal health care there, then why does privatiezed health care keep growing at an alarming rate?

And Cuba? There's no denying cuba's life expectancy (which is still lower than the U.S.), but to survey the people of a communist nation, where thoughts are controlled, are a bad idea. And indicatior is the hundreds of Cuban doctors that keep migrating to the U.S.

Come on, man. You are 21, do some research on your own!


Rolling Eyes first of all, my knowledge on health care is limited as i stated in my previous post...secondly, i do not by any means agree with all of michael moores ideas or opinions..i think for myself, however, studying this topic in class and seeing this movie has really opened my eyes about our health care system which by the way SUCKS...i never said we should have universal health care i never proposed any solution actually, i was simply summarizing a few events in the movie to further stress how much our system SUCKS...things need to change..how about you suggest a plan since you seem to know everything
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