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I thought I would make a suggestion and see what other people think, remember these are alot of what ifs.

I think they should make these laws part of the constitute if abortion does become illegal, what do you think?

Abortion illegal

1. if a men does not want children he is to have a vasectomy

2. a Man must always have contraceptives as well as a woman

3. A man must always wear a condom no matter the circumstance even for a blow job.

4. If a woman does not want children she is entilted to sterilization from the age of sexual maturity.

5. All woman must be on a form of birth and properly educated on how to use from the age of sexual maturity even if she is not having sexual intercourse.

6. rape will include to life in jail

7. Sexual assualt, doing anything you do not want to to shall be 20 years in jail

8. MEn who are caught without condoms even with a woman consent can go to jail

Not only would this prohibit pregnancy, it would also stop the spread of stds and I think if abortion ever become illegal, these laws should be stiffer as well as contraceptive obligated on both parts.
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replied May 27th, 2008
Well all of those things would still violate a persons right to medical privacy under the law so I don't see how they would be legal. It isin't the governments place to legislate consensual sex or force BC on people against their will. This is the USA not China.

Don't forget that plenty of people are allergic to latex found in condoms...and MANY women can not or do not want to take birth control because of health risks...which could include infertility and breast cancer due to the increase in estrogen in the body. I am not on hormonal BC and will NEVER subject my body to hormonal BC even though I have very painful menstrual cycles due to PCOS and a tilted cervix which BC should "help" comfort. Condoms, spermicide, and diaphragms are equally effective.

Regulated pregnancy would only lead to human rights violations. In China...pregnancy outside of marriage with out a birth permit is illegal. We have women becoming pregnant and being FORCED by the government under law to abort...even those days away from birth with viable fetuses. We have pregnant women going into hiding to give birth. We have a government that taxes pregnancy...and charges fines that take years for people to pay off. And we have young scared women SELLING infants...especially males to others to avoid punishment by the government. Kidnapping children for the black market sales trade (many infants end up in orphanages and are sold to couples overseas through international adoption and boys are often sold with in China to wealthier families that have no sons, can not get a permit for pregnancy, and need a "life insurence" policy) is rampant in China. More children are kidnapped in china then in almost any other country. Is THIS what you want America to turn into? I personally would NEVER remain in a country where the government thought it had the right to force or prohibit pregnancy or sex on or to anyone.

I do agree with a few of your points. There needs to be stiffer penalties for rape and molestation. There needs to be state wide federally funded programs that teach the proper use of BC. Women over the age of 18 years should be able to be electively sterilized...and doctors should not deny the procedure on the biased idea that girls don't actually know what they want and will change their mind.
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replied May 27th, 2008
Experienced User
Life in jail for rape is a horrible idea, since in many cases absolute truth is never found. I know of too many cases where a woman "cries rape". I'm absolutely not trying to downplay the severity of a true rape, because it is terrible. However, because it is such an ambiguous crime, I feel it's impossible to put someone in jail for life because of it.
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replied May 27th, 2008
Experienced User
"I do agree with a few of your points. There needs to be stiffer penalties for rape and molestation. There needs to be state wide federally funded programs that teach the proper use of BC. Women over the age of 18 years should be able to be electively sterilized...and doctors should not deny the procedure on the biased idea that girls don't actually know what they want and will change their mind. "

Totally agree with this! Most women if they have tubes tied IF they would change their mind it can be undone. This may result in having a hard time getting pregnant but is doable if they want this. As a pro-life this is what I say all the time. More and better education for all!!

Good post!!
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replied May 27th, 2008
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cmyked wrote:
Life in jail for rape is a horrible idea, since in many cases absolute truth is never found. I know of too many cases where a woman "cries rape". I'm absolutely not trying to downplay the severity of a true rape, because it is terrible. However, because it is such an ambiguous crime, I feel it's impossible to put someone in jail for life because of it.


Now wait a minute...you are full steam ahead for the death penalty even if one person is innocent but you give the rapist's life the benefit of the doubt? Confused
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replied May 27th, 2008
Experienced User
Because the situation require and the hard, solid physical evidence needed to prove someone guilty enough of murder to be sent to the death penalty is far, FAR more rigorous than the one shred of evidence needed to "prove" rape: a woman's tears.

Now, if the law were made in such a way that IF there was hard physical evidence proving the rape as solidly as a murder is proven when the murderer is sent to death, then perhaps life in jail would be acceptable. Right now, that's not the impression of the law or the way it works. Even the suggestion of rape can ruin a man's life.
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replied May 27th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
cmyked wrote:
Life in jail for rape is a horrible idea, since in many cases absolute truth is never found. I know of too many cases where a woman "cries rape".


Really? Like whom?
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replied May 28th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
mlynn wrote:
and MANY women can not or do not want to take birth control because of health risks...which could include infertility and breast cancer due to the increase in estrogen in the body.

which birth control causes infertility? can you provide a link proving the contraception/breast cancer risk please? thanks Smile
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replied May 28th, 2008
Active User, very eHealthy
I can tell you from personal experience that a lot of the hormonal birth control isn't recommended for women that are high risk for breast cancer. I have never been able to take it because of this.

I don't know about infertility-in fact I've never heard of bc that can cause infertility except for those specifically designed to do so, like Essure. In fact, birth control can save a woman's fertility if she develops endometriosis and takes the right bc to control it before it becomes chronic. Birth control pills low in estrogen and high in progesterone are prescribed to stop the growth of endometriosis and treat the pain caused by it. Endometriosis, if left to thrive, causes scar tissue that can eventually form not only inside of the uterus but the surrounding ovaries, bladder and pelvis as well. It's very painful (trust me) and it can not only affect a woman's quality of life due to the pain but it can also cause infertility. An old classmate of mine is having to undergo surgery to remove scar tissue so that she and her husband can try to conceive again.

I really don't think that prolifers who are against contraceptives fully grasp the health implications their stance has on women, let alone the reproductive future of women that plan to reproduce.
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replied May 28th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
Darkmoon wrote:


I really don't think that prolifers who are against contraceptives fully grasp the health implications their stance has on women, let alone the reproductive future of women that plan to reproduce.


I think you are right about that, but what's worse is, I don't think they care. Many of them have an amazing lack of empathy unless they, themselves, are the ones suffering.
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replied May 28th, 2008
Experienced User
"In fact, birth control can save a woman's fertility if she develops endometriosis and takes the right bc to control it before it becomes chronic. Birth control pills low in estrogen and high in progesterone are prescribed to stop the growth of endometriosis and treat the pain caused by it. Endometriosis, if left to thrive, causes scar tissue that can eventually form not only inside of the uterus but the surrounding ovaries, bladder and pelvis as well. It's very painful (trust me) and it can not only affect a woman's quality of life due to the pain but it can also cause infertility."

Very true! It can also help to regulate a women with irregular periods so that they can start to conceive after a period of time on the bc. It adjusts your body so that you have a regualr cycle once that is achieved they can get off the bc and try to conceive. It does not work in every one but has been done before. Smile
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replied May 28th, 2008
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cmyked wrote:
Because the situation require and the hard, solid physical evidence needed to prove someone guilty enough of homicide to be sent to the death penalty is far, FAR more rigorous than the one shred of evidence needed to "prove" rape: a woman's tears.

Now, if the law were made in such a way that IF there was hard physical evidence proving the rape as solidly as a homicide is proven when the murderer is sent to death, then perhaps life in jail would be acceptable. Right now, that's not the impression of the law or the way it works. Even the suggestion of rape can ruin a man's life.


"A woman's tears"? That's all that's needed to prove rape and lock a man in jail? A little exaggerated, don't you think?

The realities of the death penalty are not what you think. Solid evidence is nothing in the face of political pressures. I hope you do more research into the death penalty. I doubt human motivation.
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replied May 28th, 2008
Experienced User
No. A very good teacher of mine from highschool was put out of work and had to serve community time as opposed to jail time over the supposed rape of a highschool girl. There was NO physical proof, only her words.

At my college a few years ago, a girl said she was raped. The only reason the accused didn't go to jail was because she dropped the charges and said she'd been lying, but his reputation as a good kid was still ruined.

Is rape serious? Yes. Is it under reported? Yes. But is it also now being used as a tool by women to get revenge or attention? Yes.

And I am quite knowledgeable of the exceptions to the rules. They're rare.
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replied May 28th, 2008
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cmyked wrote:
No. A very good teacher of mine from highschool was put out of work and had to serve community time as opposed to jail time over the supposed rape of a highschool girl. There was NO physical proof, only her words.

At my college a few years ago, a girl said she was raped. The only reason the accused didn't go to jail was because she dropped the charges and said she'd been lying, but his reputation as a good kid was still ruined.

Is rape serious? Yes. Is it under reported? Yes. But is it also now being used as a tool by women to get revenge or attention? Yes.

And I am quite knowledgeable of the exceptions to the rules. They're rare.


This is an interesting perspective considering your stance on the death penalty.
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replied May 28th, 2008
Well, my research with infertility due to BC...has been through IUDs...not necessarily hormonal BC. My family has a long history of cancer of the reproductive organs (breast and cervical) and I have a tilted cervix and possible PCOS (getting it checked out...my mom had it...and I am now having unbearably painful periods which aren't responsive to OC painkillers and which make be vomit) . I am not willing to take the chance. Because I am at a higher risk of Breast Cancer hormonal BC isin't recommended(it always puts you at greater risk for stroke and heart attack) for me...and because complications from IUD'S like perforation, embedding, or pelvic infection can cause infertility or low fertility in women...I will avoid them at all costs. Some doctors won't even prescribe them to women below a certain age who don't have at least one child(which I don't agree with...inform women of the risks but don't block their access to a medical choice) . Low risks are still risks I am not willing to take...and those side effects with BC and IUD...although not the "norm" are still not uncommon and would be increased for someone like me with my family medical history. Source http://www.fwhc.org/birth-control/iudinfo. htm#side-effects.

My take on it (i'm not a pro-lifer) for MY body is that chemical's and artificial hormones that don't belong in the body...can not be good for the body in my case. Thats not true for all women...and all women should be free to make choices on what they believe to be best for their health and have easy access to BC, IUD's, Sterilization, and any other contraceptive or birth control option...including abortion if needed. One is capable of having responsible sex...and avoiding pregnancy....though other means....besides hormonal BC. The idea that women who get pregnant while NOT using hormonal BC and choose to abort are ill-informed and ill-responsible is not true in all cases.
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replied May 28th, 2008
Experienced User
Birch wrote:
cmyked wrote:
No. A very good teacher of mine from highschool was put out of work and had to serve community time as opposed to jail time over the supposed rape of a highschool girl. There was NO physical proof, only her words.

At my college a few years ago, a girl said she was raped. The only reason the accused didn't go to jail was because she dropped the charges and said she'd been lying, but his reputation as a good kid was still ruined.

Is rape serious? Yes. Is it under reported? Yes. But is it also now being used as a tool by women to get revenge or attention? Yes.

And I am quite knowledgeable of the exceptions to the rules. They're rare.


This is an interesting perspective considering your stance on the death penalty.

I've already responded to you elsewhere in regards to this.
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replied May 28th, 2008
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cmyked wrote:

I've already responded to you elsewhere in regards to this.


Correct. It's been very circular, and you have not reconciled it. You say that rape shouldn't be punishable by life in prison b/c of the difficulty in proving the cases. Yet when shown that the death penalty results in innocent lives lost, you are all for it and even explained that if 99 guilty people died and one innocent lost, you are still a supporter.

I find it an interesting perspective.
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replied May 28th, 2008
Experienced User
I will not discuss this on this topic and derail this discussion. Please refer your questions to the appropriate topic.
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replied May 29th, 2008
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cmyked wrote:
I will not discuss this on this topic and derail this discussion. Please refer your questions to the appropriate topic.


shes intertwining the two of them.


Everything in life share similar charactheristics, they all come down to to same reason so what is the difference?
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replied May 29th, 2008
Experienced User
I do not wish to derail this topic further.
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