Ladies and gents, just a thought that might appeal or might not: the diagnosis is actully probably different for everyone: everyone's back is different and exactly what you do with it in the daytime walking, standing, sitting, doing sport etc will all be different - but the common thing is likely to be that somewhere, somehow in the way you are moving and doing things, you strain. Some place (or several) works too hard. and while you are still moving and doping things you don't notice. But then you lie down and the muscles cool down and stop working the pain shows up. An extreme version is that someone doing sport doesn't feel pain in their muscles from over use until a few hours later. or the next day even. same thing. Its not the lying down neccessarily, its often what you were doing before. No one can give you all a catch all diagnosis that will sort everyone because while the symptoms may seem the same, exactly how you do things is individual. So if you don't have something the doctor's can work with then the best method I ever found for this kind of thing is the Feldenkrais Method. Its a nueromuscular re-education that can really help you get curious about what you are doing, feel it more clearly and develop some better ways of moving and doing things so you can to do what you want (even sleep) more easily and without pain. Maybe you know it already. Maybe it doesn't appeal.

Stuart McGill, one of the world's authorities on the back
points out that at night when you lie down the disc swells
and when you get up the disc un swells. Due to gravitational forces. Try sleeping in a bed with the feet elevated so the back is not the most dependant position.This situation is similar to feet swelling during the day, and going away by morning.

Hi!

Summary: I've had pain similar to that described by others, plus more pain. I'm now in the process of receiving diagnoses. Here's what's happened.

Out of the blue, 2-3 months ago, I woke in the middle f the night with a strong ache in my back. It felt exactly as if the muscles either side of my back were strongly tensed up - contracted. I couldn't relieve this by stretching, and it didn't make a difference whichever way I tried to lie. My back was made very stiff and uncomfortable by this and only gradually subsided once I was up and about. By the afternoon, I was perfectly fine. I'd go to bed in the evening feeling great but wake in the early hours tense and stiff again! Very mysterious. I had the same bed for two years, from new, in perfect condition so it's nothing to do with that.

I guessed that I'd pulled or compressed something in the gym with a new exercise, so I experimented by omitting one exercise in turn. This didn't suggest any conclusion and the intense ache arrived some nights, recur for a few nights in succession, then later be missing for several nights in succession. Odd.

After a few weeks of this, I coincidentally moved addresses, leaving my own bed behind. In my new home, I initially had no problem. Then the ache arrived. Then the ache went away but I started to wake in the early hours with a severe pain in a specific part of my spine. It felt as I imagine it would feel if a knife was stuck in my back! And I was almost scared to move. But one has to get up sometime, so I'd get up each morning in agony, pushing myself up very carefully and slowly from bed. I'd be in this pain, and find it painful and difficult to move my spine for a few hours. Finally, as with the other ache, the pain would subside helped by sitting with good posture or walking. By night-time, I had only an ache.

Having the ache AND then such pain prompted me to book an appointment with an orthopaedic surgeon. In the meantime, I changed beds. In the other bed, I had no trouble. Over a period of 6 or 7 days, my ache subsided so when I saw the doctor I felt only a very slight localised ache and felt great.

I keep fit, do some weights, and run and I'm in great nick for 44. The doctor checked me out, including twisting me to see how flexible I was, and pushing his fingers into my spine all over. From the outside, everything was described using words like great and perfect. The only issue was one small on my spine which was very painful when he pressed it. I went for X-rays and returned to the doctor for the bad news.

X-rays reveal hypnosis (minor curve in upper back), scoliosis (lateral S-curve in spine), and spondylosis (degeneration of the spine). Crikey! It's the spondylosis that is most unpleasant and the likely cause of the pain possibly a nerve occasionally trapped by vertebrae that are too close together as a result of disc degeneration. I've been researching information and how to fight back on the internet and I'll be going for an MRI scan soon to find out more about what's going on inside. There are nasty possibilities such as arthritis.

I'd appreciate any feedback on this. I have identified various good sources of information on these conditions, treatments, and exercises, if anyone's interested.

Hi, this same back muscle discomfort started this week. Maybe I've had it but didn't notice it. I wake up and have this sort of pain . .don't have it in the daytime or when I'm sitting or walking or any other time, only when lying down after a few hrs of sleep. I gained 30 lbs since caring for my mom who is 88. But in the summer I swim more and I think during the breast stroke my back/neck has a different position. Also I went to the beach this week and let the high stormy waves hit my back..So maybe I thought this was the reason, muscles are sore, like something slamming into me . .like the waves did. Wonder if those are things that could be the cause? Also did a lot of sitting watching
TV this week as it was too hot here in CA to do any
big activities. I never take any meds. I ll be 65 next month.hp

Yup, same thing here. It started about 2 months ago and wakes me up every night around 3. Like FriedClutch a few pages back and few others here, I'm 33, very active and experience no pain throughout the day. Only at night. Also had fears of kidney issues, but it certainly felt as if it was centralized in the right side of my spine, mid way down my back. The pain radiated to pretty much my entire mid-back region though, and all but disappears when I stand or sit up. If I were to gauge this pain on a 1-10 scale, I would say it fluctuates a bit. some nights it's a 5. other's a 7. Regardless, it wakes me up EVERY NIGHT.

Long story short, had back X-Rays done two weeks ago and they concluded the problem was early onset arthritis in my spine coupled with a 'touch' of scoliosis. I had no clue scoliosis had a range, always thought it was either 'had it' or 'didn't'. apparently I was wrong.

I'm heading back into the doc in a few weeks so I'll let you all know if I learn anything new. While it's great to know I'm not alone with this pain, gotta say, kinda feel like we're rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic here. As we can either take Advil every night for god knows how long, or sleep on an herbal pillow with the windows open or in a recliner with a glass of milk.

Hi, Sconway55!

Is your back ache on the opposite side of your scoliosis curve? If so, from what I've researched, I imagine it could result from your back muscles straining to compensate.

Following my MRI scan - which revealed a number of small protrusions of discs - I got great information from the radiologist. The highlight of this is that the scoliosis and herniated discs may be fixed. Proper posture and lifting, swimming, and stretching backwards, will help.

The single best online source of information I've found is this:
http://www.umm.edu/spinecenter/education/a dult_scoliosis.htm

Much research has also found that yoga, pilates, and maintainging a muscular core (for posture and back support) recur as recommendations.

Smoking is a BIG no-no, as it restricts oxygen supply to your back.

Diet-wise, I've seen repeated recommendations for back health: garlic (anti-pain); calcium, vitamins C and D (for bone health); and a generally good diet.

I hope you find some of this helpful. Good luck with your back!

Dave,

Thanks for the info. This is all very helpful. Except the part where you said I need to quit smoking. ;~)

I also experience this problem. My podiatrist(foot doctor) suggested that shoes can contribute to lower back pain. Especially very flat shoes and at the other extreme, very high heels.
Something else to think about.

Span33,

Don't mix a flat shoe with a high heel - that should ease the problem.

I too have been having upper to mid back pain, it started 4 yrs ago. It wakes me up in the middle of the night, it used to be after exactly 3 hrs of sleep and more recently, it wakes me up after about 1 hr. I am in severe pain!
I will wake and prop pillows behind my back (90 degreee angle) to relieve tha pain, but that often times makes my lower back hurt. The pain will dissapate after 30-60 min of being up and out of bed. Needless to say I have not slept much in the last 4 yrs.
When this started, I bought a new bed... it didn't work, I then got a x ray, a CT scan, an MRI. The MD's put me on muscle relaxers, then they thought it was acid reflux... no, I was on a "pain relief program," which is essentially a ton of meds, I was seen in the ER after a panic attack b/c the pain was so bad and they did another x-ray and gave me an intramuscular shot of Toradol...instant relief. Then they thought maybe my heart (I'm a healthy 28 y/o) so I had a cardiac stess test, EVERYTHING was normal. 3 yrs of this then I got pregnant and the pain intensified over my whole spine, and not only at night, this was the worst 9 mo of my life. After the baby was born, it became night pain once again. The MD's now want me to have another MRI, this time with contrast, so this is what I am currnetly waiting to do. I am breastfeeding, so I can't have that done until I am done d/t the contrast. I currently don't take anything for pain other than Ibuprofen, I would take more if it helped. There has to be someone out there who has had a diagnosis, very interesting we all have such similar stories. Please help!!

Candy,

First, remember that there are many causes of back problems, and many ways of trying to make things better.

I will tell you what I think, you can consider it and research it, and make what use you think fit of the result.

Having been X-rayed, scanned, done research, and spoken to specialists, I am now muc better informed about what's going on in my back.

I associate back pain that arises part-way through the night, and gradually disappears after being up and about for a few hours, with herniated discs. This is when some discs (the padding between bones in the spine) are pushed outside their normal position. This could happen due to some heavy or improper lifting, for example).

Once we're grown up, our discs - like other parts of us - are less elastic than when we were younger, and so don't so readily snap back into position. Thus, a herniated disc can stay protruded. Very many people have these without knowing it because they haven't noticed symptoms. The obvious symptom is pain - as I had - due to the protrusions pressing on the nerves near the spine. Ouch!

When we're in bed, our weight is off our spine and he discs, which enables the discs - quite normally - to swell up a little with fluid. Any herniated discs thus protrude more and so may trigger the pain not felt during the day. When we're up for a while, the swelling subsides and the discs protrude less, so the pain may go away. I had many seemingly bizarre days of oscillating between extreme night-time pain and entirely painless afternoons. I have herniated discs.

Herniated discs can simply get better, or need treatments, or even be the subject of surgery.

I'm all for treatment via plenty of exercise (e.g. 30-40 mins, 5 days per week aerobic exercise, swimming at least once a week), good posture, proper lifting, and NO surgery.

For advice in general, the VERY BEST source I have been able to find was here:

http://www.umm.edu/ask_the_expert/index.ht m

I found this excellent, and you can ask a doctor a question, receive a direct answer, and also see their Q & A archive.

Good luck, Candy. You may feel well soon!

Dave
Yes, this is helpful. Are you better after exercise and other treatments? I will go the link you provided Thankyou I am going to see a accupuncturist on Friday. I'll post if it did anything for me or not. Some days I am so tired from lack of sleep it is difficult to function.

Candy,

At one time, I woke early in agony or was at least stooped, achy and slow like an old man.

Currently, I'm feeling fantastic most of the time, with just occasional mornings that are slightly achy or stiff. And sometimes my back doesn't feel like it has the strength it used to. But I could be doing more to make my back better!

I think the things that most made my back better were:
* Ensuring good posture ALL THE TIME. For example, sitting up properly at the computer in the way those ergonomic stools make you;
* Stretching my back by relaxing on the bed, tummy down with my chin propped up on my hands so I'm looking forward - that felt good;
* Persisting stubbornly - except when it actually HURT - with my exercise (running)
* Having strong core muscles (tummy and back)
* Natural self-healing

As my back doesn't feel perfectly better, I know:
* I should go swimming regularly
* I'm interested in the "cold room" treatment

For you, I suggest:
* Try stretching, find what feels good and explore and pursue that! Yoga would probably be good for you.
* Strengthen your core. It's good for posture and makes maintaining good posture easy. Pilates is good.
* Go swimming with your baby - it's never too early.
* Aerobic exercise, minimum 30 mins 5 days per week, will help - amongst other things - put a healthy blood flow through your spinal area to deliver what's god for it
* While you don't sleep enough at night, schedule a cat-nap during the day. 30-60 mins will work wonders!

I'd be surprised if accupuncture achieved any more than temporary relief by inducing relaxation. You need a diagnosis for peace of mind, and so that you can research more effectively, and so you can take positive steps more confidently. Having said that, the things I've suggested are good for almost anything.

Remember cat-naps, and think positive!

Regards,
Dave.

It's almost scary to find other people describing the way I have been feeling for the past 2 weeks!
The day it started, i had two skin biopsies taken, one from my thigh on from my wrist. Two months ago I started developing lesions in my lower body and a scratch on my wrist turned 'weird'. Very long story, I am better but we don't know what it was and (I) decided for the biopsies. That night the pain woke me up (3:30am), I thought it was my overdoing crunches or something. I am recuperating from a shoulder injury and have not swum in one year, I still go to the pool and kick for a couple Km.
I am to the point of being afraid of going to bed 'cause I just know pain is going to wake me up.
Pain is more on the left side, in the front I started feeling some kind of stabbing pain right below the ribbcage, left side. Have had trouble pushing myself out of bed.
Recently moved to a new place and started a new job.
I am very active, although this past year my shoulder has kept me from swimming. I eat very balanced (vegetarian), in general I am in great shape for my age (40's)
I am seeing the doctor in a couple of days.

You seem to be describing abdominal rather than back pain. Maybe you have both?

Is it possible your abdominal pain is a hernia?
I think it possible your shoulder injury could have left you walking, sitting, etc. not quite straight, as a result of compensating for the weakness resulting from your injury. This can lead to your posture and spine being out of alignment, giving rise to aches and pains from muscles that strain to compensate for that!

But that's just me blabbing a lot of possibilities I learned from my oersonal research. Think carefully about the details of your symptoms so you provide your doctor a full, accurate and concise description. The doc will hopefully quickly realise the correct diagnosis.

I wish you well, TPA. Think positive about things getting better - it helps, as I'm sure you know. Chin up and all that!

P.S. You can still "swim" with one arm - just loll about on your back, gently using your arms, and kicking. It can do you good to take the weight off your bones - if your aches are spine or muscle related.

I had this exact problem and I got a 7" wedge and now sleep with my pillow at the top of that and I have no problems at all. My back was over-extending at night and I would wake up in the middle of the night with a sore back. The wedge keeps me from over arching and how I don't overextend and I sleep great each night!!!! Good luck I know this is a terrible condition that robs you of your sleep. Please let me know if this helps.

Is this a body-length wedge with the thick end at the head, so that you're sleeping on an incline?

Hey all,

DaveSmiler: thanks for your previous response. Doctor's appointment went well. Physical was fine. We ran a panel of lab tests, everything was fine except tryglicerides. Ridiculously high for someone with my lifestyle and diet (>450). We will discuss them tomorrow.

NewUser111509: I was wondering, too, what kind of wedge is this? Body length? where did you get it from?

Thanks and best regards.

Update:

So, after seeing a physical therapist for the past month, things have VASTLY improved. I was diagnosed with both early onset arthritis and scoliosis. By doing an on-going series of exercises to strengthen my core and the back muscles both above and below the area effected by the scoliosis I am now almost entirely pain free.

Not sure if this info will help anyone, but decided to post anyway.

SCC

Hiya TPA,

I imagine you might end up adjusting what you eat and how often, to help control how your body produces fat. It sounds like you're making progress anyway. Super.

Good luck with everything.

Regards,
Dave.