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Conditions and Diseases > Hypoglycemia Forum > Faintness -> Living In Hell! <- Adrenals Exhausted? (Page 1)
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Q: Faintness -> Living In Hell! <- Adrenals Exhausted?
asked by: Babouin on June 10th, 2006
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Hi,

here is my problem. Thanks in advance for reading me.



I used to be fat (225 pounds ) and used to eat sugar all the time, from morning to night. I could eat nearly a gallon of ice cream a day, with pepsi, with chocolate, milk, etc. I was sick, but wasn't really aware of it.



3 years ago (in 2003) I fainted at a restaurant after eating nearly nothing substantial all day long (except energy drinks and alcohol) and been out in the sun for hours (what a crazy mix, of course). This was a traumatic event and it took nearly a year to get back on my feet and to feel more comfortable socially (i have mild social phobia, but usually I can live with it in 'normal' conditions). My doctor prescribed some prozac and I was able to continue to live my life.



At this time, I met an osteopath who convinced me to change the way I was living. Thanks to her advices, I lost nearly 70 pounds over the next year and a half, and I am now in great shape, maintaining that good weight.

However, as much as I changed my alimentation (i eliminated nearly all sugar, from milk to pasta to anything else... Only sugar on rare occasions) my relation to food did not change: I am obsessive with food and eat a lot and it seemed to me the total sugar did not change that much instead of eating lot of ice cream I ate lot (and I mean it!) of legumes or nuts. I ate so much fat that I was diagnosed with functional dyspepsia and I am unable to ingest much fat anymore.



Anyway, getting to the point...



At the beginning of this year, I had to take a blood test, and fainted. I thought this was normal, so I didn't care that much. I must say that I nearly stopped prozac for a year, and on that morning I didn't eat at all and wasn't in great shape.



In april 2006, I met a new girl, and I fainted at the restaurant after the second night together. This was the morning following easter. On easter I ate badly, and did not eat anything from 7 pm sunday to 1 pm monday. And of course I was very active physically that night. :wink:

ok right now everything seems to point in direction of severe hypoglycemia. I was at the restaurant, and everything went strange in my head, with confusion, and I fainted. I was unconscious for nearly 1 minute and a half, and it took 2 hours for my pressure to get back to a close-to-normal range.



But here is the thing that made me doubt (and my doctor too) about hypoglycemia: I fainted after eating breakfast. And it was a breakfast with lot of sugar, maple syrup, etc. So that's strange, don't you think?



Even stranger: when the ambulance arrived, the first thing they did was taking my sugar level: it was normal. :!:

so those two facts made me doubt about hypoglycemia.



Meanwhile, my doctor prescribed celexa and I began a new job.



However, yesterday I had symptoms close to those at the restaurant. After 4 hours straight without eating anything and been very active talking to people and everything, I felt weak and had to go to toilet and get on the ground for some minutes. I ate an apple (even if I wasn't that hungry... I was cold, I had blurred vision, etc.). I thought this was a 'normal' panic attack like I had some (fearing to faint again) but the strange thing was that the anxiety was coming from inside me and not from the outside world.



Anyway, I did pray a bit and did stay there for 5 minutes and was able to finish my day. However, I must say that I get phobic right now about the thought of working at that particular place again (at my job there is 6 different locations to work).



Anyway, my life is hell right now. I have panic attacks everywhere always, and it seems I just can't get over what seems to be hypoglycemia even by eating like an athlete (i really eat well... Meat, vegetables, legumes, some nuts, fruits... I really eat well those days). It seems all the 'tricks' do not work anymore for me.



Is it possible that my symptoms relate to something else than hypoglycemia?

Or was it possible that between the time I fainted and the time ambulance took my sugar level the sugar went up enough to be normal but not enought to make me feel well?



Is it possible that my adrenals are so exhausted that they don't work well anymore? (don't forget: I have a low-carb diet, which mean that my adrenals must transform proteins and fats into glucose by gloconeogenesis, which may exhaust them!?)

anyway, I feel like I am living in hell right now. This new job is a dream job with a good salary and I want to keep it! And I have a new girlfriend. I sure have lot of stress right now, but I just have trouble to differentiate physicals and psychologicals symptoms, even if they are related.



I know I should maybe take the hyperglycemia test, but right now I work on call and I know taking that test would narly 'kill me' for a whole week. Moreover, some days it seems my glycemia seems to be working better. I feel bad mostly on the days after eating badly, not in the hours.

But even there, I nearly fainted at job some hours after eating a very good meal...



Anybody can help me?



Thanks a lot for reading me.
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Stan
replied on June 10th, 2006
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Hahahaha, normal?!!!!!!! Hhahahaha, I doubt it, I seriously do. What was the reading when they took it? After eating something like that a drop like this would be expected. Your pancreas is simply overcompensating. Find a new doctor, the one you have is obviously an fool. It's not strange at all you fainted after a meal like that. Your pancreas is in overdrive. The only way to fix it is to eat correctly. What is your current diet in total (write down everything you tend to eat). I guarantee you're eating things you're not supposed to eat and aren't aware they're bad for you. For example, legumes should be absolutely avoided at first for at least six months, less for some people and up to a year for others. What is your current carb intake level? If it's around 90-100g, even a bit less for some people, you shouldn't be worrying about your adrenals. It isn't until around 85g and less that the body runs into the mode you're talking about. Otherwise it can do fine.
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Babouin
replied on June 10th, 2006
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Hi, thanks for your reply!

Actually they took the sugar test from my finger right at the restaurant, minutes after I fainted. They said it was 'normal'. My osteopath also believe it was a reaction to what I ate this morning... But I was already really really weak before eating; I was walking like if I was on a cloud, very weak (i did not eat anything for hours with physical activities I ate badly the night before).

I fainted as I was finishing my plate. I did not even have the chance to finish it.

What I eat right now: (an example)

morning:

- 1 apple
- 1-2 eggs wild rice vegetables

dinner:

- salmon salad (salad salmon sometimes wild rice garlic ginger some vegetables olive oil/lemon)

in the afternoon:

- strawberries/blueberries/raspberries, or some pineapple (i know pinappele has lot of sugar, but still its content of 'real' sugar is still not that hight)

supper:

- salad with tofu or salmon or chicken...
- or chicken/tofu/salmon with vegetables and some legumes (chich peas or adzuki beans, mostly)

in the evening:

- some fruit or some legumes with salt.


I really think I eat good... But even if this is not perfect, what is wrong with me? I mean: I shouldn't get sick like that with what I eat! Ok, sometimes I will eat some yugourt or even have dessert, but this is rare...

Thanks
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Stan
replied on June 10th, 2006
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That is pretty healthy, however you mentioned up there that you ate some pretty bad food. How religiously do you stick to this diet? I can tell you from experience, one day of a mistake can lead to somtimes a week or two of pain and if you keep doing it it will only get worse.
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Babouin
replied on June 11th, 2006
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Actually I was diagnosed with functional dyspepsia and it seems my liver just can't assimilate fat fast enough. Sure, sometimes I eat bad, but sometimes I get real sick for no really good reason.

Example: yesterday I ate nuts in the afternoon while at job to keep my sugar level at a good ratio. I was eating like 3-4 nuts each 15-20 minutes. I ate maybe 100 g. Of nuts in the whole afternoon. But anyway I felt bad as the day was passing; it was like my liver or pancreas was unable to shoot all the enzymes necessary to assimilate "all" that fat. In the evening, I ate my usual fish and I felt very bad all night long, and especially in the next morning, with nausea, but also I was very weak.

I keep a log of what I eat for the last 1 year and a half. I noted that each time I fainted, I had poor sleep and I had the impression my liver was rushing, or that is was weak, and that I wasn't able to correctly assimilate fat.

And this morning that was how it felt. I was weak, really weak. I was able to eat an apple, and even eat a bit more later, but I wasn't hungry and even eating was not enough: I was close to faint and felt lightheaded and fuzzy and everything. It was like I just had an intense physical activity when I did nothing... Nothing else than trying to assimilate the food...

My hypothesis is that I may have something linked to the gluconeogenesis process, which transform proteins and fats into glucose. It's like my organs were unable to correctly do the job and each time I eat "too much" fat (pretty relative, as I don't eat that much fat) or I am too stressed for a long period of time, I just can't get enough energy to keep me from panic attacks, anxiety, or just to make my blood flow to my brain!

I just can't explain how bad I was feeling this morning. I went to job and was sure I was going to faint. I was so weak. I managed to eat some whole grain kamut pasta and some vegetables, along with strawberries on the job, but I was weak...

My therapist believes that I am simply too much anxious. Yes, I am. But why would I feel perfectly fine on day a to go my job and the next day, on day b, I feel like crap and fear everything around me?!

I really don't know what to think. I feel like I am not normal. I am 26 years old and I feel like my organs are 60.

Thanks for reading!
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Stan
replied on June 11th, 2006
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Very interesting, and unfortunately confusing. I thought dyspepsia was just a stomach pain that was continuous. If you think you have an organ problem, you should have blood work done to see what's going on if you haven't already. If nothing shows, it can't be that. I must think about this more. I think you are simply eating too much at once and not giving your body enough time to digest. Eating that much every 15 minutes is probably driving your body nuts. Every two hours at the most is the typical regimine. Also, you're wrong on something. You don't get the panic attacks with hypoglycemia because there's not enough energy. If you think that, you need to know that yes, the sugar is low, but you get the anxiety and such because the brain begins to shut parts of the body down or keeps them running on minimal sugar. Have you tried a high carbohydrate diet? If you have trouble with protein and fat that should fix the problem. You could eat around 25g of protein per day and low fat with tons of carbs and if you really have that problem it should go away quickly with this approach.
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Babouin
replied on June 13th, 2006
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Hi,

thanks you for your reply.

The thing is... I was eating a very high-carb diet and I was fat. I went to a low-carb diet and now I look healthy and lost nearly 70 pounds. So to me it is out of question to go back to ahigh-carb diet... That would make no sense to me, after all the effort I put to lose that weight!

Thanks for the information on anxiety... But I thought that the process was not that the brain "shuts" some part of the body, but rather that adrenals shoots adrenaline to compensate for low blood sugar, and it is this adrenaline which created the symptoms of anxiety and panic?!

I am a very anxious person and I try to cope with this. I know that when I don't have too much stress I can cope with my hypoglycemia. But when I get stress for a long period of time, it seems my body becomes exhausted and it just doesn't work well anymore.

Of course, I could simply quit this good job and quit my girlfriend and get back to a lone life... But I don't think this would be a solution in the long run and I wouldn't be happier.

I wonder if there are other persons with anxiety problems related to hypoglycemia?!
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Stan
replied on June 13th, 2006
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There are probably a lot. And yes, that can be part of it too, the adrenals will do this sometimes. Other times, when you find yourself worrying or anxious about nothing in particular, it usually is a part of the neocortex shutting down or running low on glucose. I noticed that a few weeks after beginning treatment this is what was happening. I wouldn't feel the same adrenaline surge as before, I would just find something bothering me strangely at random. Sometimes you never know what it is until it creeps into your head. If you're on a high carb diet that gets rid of the problem you mention, fat can be kept off if you maintain a relatively low protein intake and a low to moderate fat intake. What were you doing before in this regard? If not, the only thing I can suggest is that you try to only eat every two hours at most, regardless of how you feel at first. You're probably eating too much too often. Also, are you eating fruit on an empty stomach? Not good at first. The only thing I can suggest to you is to regulate your carbohydrates to no more than 100g a day and no less than 60g a day. You need to find the carbohydrate level that makes you the most comfortable and stick with it for at least six months. The only possibility as to why your diet would be causing problems is this reason, along with the fact that you're eating a few things you shouldn't be eating at first.
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Babouin
replied on June 15th, 2006
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Thank you very much for the advice!

There seem to be a lot of contradiction between many theories... Concerning fruits, I read that they should only be eaten on empty stomach because they take only 15 minutes to pass through the stomach and if you take them with other type of food they will fermentate and produce bloating and bad assimilation.

As for high-carb low-protein low-fat, that was what I was eating when I was 225 pounds (i am 155 today)... I am sure you understand I don't want to get back there! :wink:

but I will try smaller meals more often. But it sure does not help my functional dyspepsia... 2 hours seems like too short for my stomach, but I will try no more than 3 hours.

As for my initial question, do you think it is possible to faint because of hypoglycemia, and then when the ambulance arrives to have a 'normal' sugar level?

Right now I am working very hard on my panic symptoms and trying real hard to overcome them. But each time I get the slightest hypoglycemia symptom, my mind goes crazy and I think I will faint again, lose my job, make a fool of myself and die alone and miserable.

Working hard on myself, but not quite it yet until I can be 100% sure that I will not faint again!

Thanks
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Stan
replied on June 15th, 2006
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Where did you read this? Be very careful with health advice from natural remedy people and such, stuff like this, and theories such as the whole alkalinity thing, are a bunch of crap. I've heard this one before. It's impossible for fruit to ferment in your stomach. The reason you don't eat it on an empty stomach is two-fold. 1. Doing so means the sugar will go into your body sooner since you haven't mixed it with a meal containing protein and fat. The pancreas in many hypoglycemics acts quickly to fast rises, regardless if it pushes the blood sugar too high. What it reads is the elevation, not just the level. So you need to avoid this. 2. Along with number one, the pancreas can actually "sense" what's coming through the digestive tract and based on carbohydrate and sugar content it will shoot out more insulin. This must also be avoided. Straight sugar will seem dangerous to it because it assumes it's facing a sugary meal. Quite simple. How can 2 hours be too short? You said before you're eating something every fifteen minutes. It takes roughly that amount of time for everything to be into the intestines. Nuts take longer to digest, and if you just keep pumping them in there every fifteen minutes, it's going to catch up with you. Three hours is fine though, try that. What you said is possible. Here's why (and this goes with nearly any symptom). When you have the symptom, whatever it is, the sugar level is already being brought back up. It reached a low level, the body begins to work bringing it back up, and the symptom persists until the level is regulated. Thus, you could faint at a level of 50, the ambulance comes, but it's already back up to 70 because the body has reacted to it. So that is to be expected. You never answered my question though, what did they say your "normal" level was. Don't forget that with hypoglycemia the level doesn't matter, it's the speed of the drop for the most part. You could have a drop of 90 to 65 which is within the "normal" range, but if this happens in an hour you're going to get symptoms because the level went down too fast for the brain to keep up with it. What you describe must also be remembered to be a symptom itself, constant worrying or anticipating bad things and such. It's a symptom, and difficult to get past. Eventually, I just came to the conclusion that I have to get through it, there is nothing to stop the symptoms during treatment, if they come, screw 'em. Sure, I had times I broke down and cried for a minute or so, but I came right back and said forget it, it will pass. It's not like you're going to faint and die. Learn to not fear fainting, the best thing you can learn with this disease is how to control yourself, it's hard, but you'll get it. As the symptoms begin to disappear you will.
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Babouin
replied on June 16th, 2006
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Hi,

well for the fruit-fermentation connection, it made sense to me as I observed that I had bloating and gas when I eat them straight after supper. I do not remember where exactly I read about it, but I can feel the difference: when I eat fruits alone, I don't have gas, and when I eat fruits right after a meal, I have gas and bloating...

The explanation which I had at first is simply that fruits take only 15 minutes to get to the intestins while a complete meal (with proteins and fat) can take much longer. So if the simple fruit sugar are 'catched' in the stomach for a long time, they will fermentate and cause gas and bloating later... Well I might be wrong; but this is what I thought.

For my sugar level, they did not tell me what it was or I don't remember. I had blood pressure close to 50, so I wasn't in great shape! :wink:


what is really difficult for me to understand is why I fainted. I mean: I do have some hypoglycemic symptoms sometimes, but my body usually adjust. Sure, that night I did not sleep more than 2 hours, sure I was sexually active, sure I had not eaten anything for 18 hours. But why did I fainted that much? I mean: I fainted after eating, and I was unconscious for at least a minute and a half, which seem pretty long to me!

Right now I am reading books on panic attacks and trying to cope with it. But this is not easy at all. Before fainting, I used to live with the symptoms, but right now at the minute I have the slightest symptom I get panic attack and symptoms get worst and worst! This is really difficult.

I try to use some techniques of relaxation, but when my sugar level appears to be low and noradrenaline and adrenaline are rushing in my body, it just makes me feel bad.

Anyway, maybe I should take an hypoglycemia test 'just to be sure'. I sure have a problem with anxiety, but I am not too prone right now to take the hyperglycemia test because I would feel bad for days.

I am currently reading "hypoglycemia for dummies". Pretty interesting. I need to connect the dots.

Thanks
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tygrbabi
replied on June 16th, 2006
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Babouin: i've been reading your "conversation" with stan and I wanted to interject. It is highly possible that your anxiety stems from hypoglycemia. Maybe it's something else. But the symptoms you exhibit lead me to believe you have hypoglycemic tendencies, at the very least. I have anxiety (stemming from hypoglycemia) and my first attack came without warning, when I thought I was seemingly healthy. I found this forum and to my surprise my "healthy" snacks, like hummus, were some of the culprits. Stan's diet has helped immensely. Have you looked at it?

Now getting back to your anxiety. I understand how you feel. Lack of sleep is a contributor. I can sleep no less than 4 hours otherwise, i'm worthless. Almonds help when I start to have an attack, too. Also, there is a product called Dr. Bach's rescue remedy. It's a tincture of various herbs that help with anxiety. The best way to describe it ... It's like taking a deep breath. I carry it with me. It really helps a lot. I want to point out, though, since following stan's diet and getting back on track with my doctor. I have used Dr. Bach's rescue remedy less and less.

Good luck to you! And I hope you're discussing your issues with your girlfriend. She needs to understand what's happening. Otherwise, there might be a lot of miscommunication and that will only add to your stress.
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Stan
replied on June 16th, 2006
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Ahhh, I see what you mean. Fermentation can't occur that quickly, that's what I meant. The only thing I can think of there is you have an imbalance of digestive enzymes or something. Or, because of something like this, the sugar may be feeding bad bacteria in the stomach. I myself actually got bloating when I first started treatment and it slowly went away. It only occured during the first part of the day, not later. Try just a small amount of fruit with each meal to see what happens, and I mean small. Seriously try like 1/8 of an orange slice or whatever you eat to see how your body reacts. So why so concerned you fainted? Everything you said there points to something happening, fainting or otherwise. Not eating for that long? I think you're confused because you ate, but remember that your body had nothing in it stored up to counteract the drop, so you fainted. In addition, didn't you say you had pancakes with syrup or something? That's no surprise then and a minute or so of fainting is not a big deal. I fainted for a few minutes once when I got a wound many years ago. If it was an hour, yeah that's strange, but not a minute. I agree with ty. If you follow a hypoglycemic diet for a period of around six months (sometimes longer for others to have full results), you will notice within that time a lessening of symptoms. If not, you may have tendencies towards low blood sugar but have something else wrong. It may be simply general anxiety disorder or something, it may not. In addition, the test is not absolutely necessary. If you read in that book you just mentioned, she states in there how you can test yourself without worrying about the money or the sugar problems after. Avoid all sugar and see what happens. If you notice a change, you've got it, if you don't then you don't have it. Also, if you follow my diet and avoid what I say to avoid you will see results. If you don't, something else is wrong. Everyone who has tried the diet has seen results. Some have to adjust parts of it to suit their needs, but everyone here seems to be doing quite well on it and i'm happy. Follow it religiously and see what it does. If no change is noted after up to six months (usually one is all it takes to at least notice some change), start getting tested for whatever you can think of. I also suggest natural anxiety remedies, another i've heard of is gaba, I think it's relatively cheap. Whatever you do be careful of what she says in that book, there's a lot of good information but also a bit of bad information that can screw things up. She suggests eating grapes for fruit, for example, which is a big no. Remind me again, how long have you been on this diet?
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Babouin
replied on June 19th, 2006
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tygrbabi wrote:
babouin: i've been reading your "conversation" with stan and I wanted to interject. It is highly possible that your anxiety stems from hypoglycemia. Maybe it's something else. But the symptoms you exhibit lead me to believe you have hypoglycemic tendencies, at the very least. I have anxiety (stemming from hypoglycemia) and my first attack came without warning, when I thought I was seemingly healthy. I found this forum and to my surprise my "healthy" snacks, like hummus, were some of the culprits. Stan's diet has helped immensely. Have you looked at it?


Now getting back to your anxiety. I understand how you feel. Lack of sleep is a contributor. I can sleep no less than 4 hours otherwise, i'm worthless. Almonds help when I start to have an attack, too. Also, there is a product called Dr. Bach's rescue remedy. It's a tincture of various herbs that help with anxiety. The best way to describe it ... It's like taking a deep breath. I carry it with me. It really helps a lot. I want to point out, though, since following stan's diet and getting back on track with my doctor. I have used Dr. Bach's rescue remedy less and less.


Good luck to you! And I hope you're discussing your issues with your girlfriend. She needs to understand what's happening. Otherwise, there might be a lot of miscommunication and that will only add to your stress.


i am happy to see that I am not alone with this kind of attack... But what is wrong with hummus? I mean: hummus is basically chick peas crushed, and chick peas have like... 20-25% complex carbs at most?! Aren't legumes excellent for hypoglycemia?

About sleep it is the same for me: if I sleep less than 4 hours I just can't make my day... I feel like I will have an attack everywhere, I have no energy, I have vertigo every time I get up and get confused all the time...

About almonds... I have a problem with fat (maybe stan is right about some enzyme problem?!) absorption I think. Well, officially I have functional dyspepsia, but I have real trouble digesting fats. As an example: saturday I ate 42 almonds at 3 differents times in the day (12/15/15). Believe it or not I stayed awake all night long until 6 a.M. With my stomach hurting and my liver which seemed ready to explode. And it's the same with other nuts as well. But really, I am not allergic to nuts I believe (i used to be able to eat 300-500 g. Of any nuts in 2-3 hours in a binge) but it seems I can't tolerate fat anymore. I can eat an egg in the morning and salmon with olive oil in the evening, but that's it!

So the big problem for me is trying to eat not too much carbs but not eating too much fat either.

In "hypoglycemia for dummies" I read that eating too much protein or not enough carbs can lead to damage to the liver or kidneys. I wonder if that may be my case, as I am on a low-carb diet for the last 2 years (but to be honest I had some frequent 'exceptions' in the last months... But still, only exceptions!). It is like my body is unable to do its job with food...

So right now I try to eat a without much fat or carbs, but even there it's pretty difficult. My digestion is slow and difficult. And I get a strong hypoglycemic reaction about 1 to 1 and a half hour after eating fruits or vegetables or 1 and half to 3 hours after eating a meal with fat/protein.

Stan: I try to eat less fruits and it sure helps. Less fruits = less bloating!

I also have an anxiety problem that's sure (that is why I was prescribed celexa after all) but the thing that makes it worst is that I can't be 100% sure why I did faint when I fainted. It makes me crazy.

I eat very well for the last 2 years, and sure every time I eat well "without exceptions" I feel better, but even after all this time every time I have the slightest relapse I feel real bad for days.

But anyway, I don't think it is good for me to be on a low-carb for life... I really think I am eating too much fat and protein, which may overload my liver/pancreas/adrenal. So I tried recently to introduce some complete kamut pasta and it did not work (strong hypoglycemic reaction).

I also try to work on my anxiety, but most of the time it seems its my hypoglycemia which is triggering anxiety and not the opposite. So I am a bit confused!

Thanks!
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Stan
replied on June 19th, 2006
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Why are you still confused? Hypoglycemia causes anxiety, enough said, it's just a normal bodily reaction. Legumes are awful for hypoglycemia. They'll only work if you have functional hypoglycemia or the organic kind. They're absolutely to be avoided for anyone that has reactive hypoglycemia, at least at first. Eventually you can slowly add them back in, but not for at least six months. I see you came across that section in hypoglycemia for dummies. I can tell you from experience, reading and others' experiences that legumes must be avoided at first. Olive oil should be readily digested by anyone as far as i've read. It's actually the best fat for the digestive system and helps cleanse the liver. However, I did have these problems early on. I remember one instance where I had a piece of turkey skin (i ate it for the fat content). Within 10 minutes I had the worst bloating, pain and hypoglycemic reaction ever. I was rolling on the floor crying and begging for it to stop for a least forty minutes. This seems to happen to people at first during treatment, but I really don't know why. Makes sense that you can eat an egg just fine, they're loaded with about 95% of readily digestible human proteins, so your body has to do the least amount of work to get it through you. You'd have to eat a sick amount of protein to have a negative result, like around 300g, which is not easy to do. Not enough carbohydrates translates to less than 60g a day, otherwise you'll be okay. To avoid ketosis, though, which is what some people argue may be a major problem with low carb diets (though it's not proven yet), you need to be around 90-100g a day. Still low carb, but enough that you avoid the extra strain on the kidneys. The only options you have are either high fat or high protein diets. It sounds like high protein is the only way for you to go. I can assure you it will be fine, the theory, which again is not proven yet, is that over the long term (like many years, at least 10-20) it may be bad for the kidnies. Since you'll only be on the diet in it's basic form at most for one year, you have nothing to worry about. What kind of vegetables are you eating to get a reaction like that? It sounds to me like you're expecting to feel good immediately after getting the right diet. This, unfortunately, couldn't be further from the truth. You will have ups and downs and drops all the time when you begin treatment. It sounds to me like that is exactly what's happening to you but you want to think that's it a bad thing. It means the body is getting better. That is, however, if you are eating the right things. If you're eating carrots, potatoes or anything on my list, you won't get better. Adding pasta or anything now is not a good idea, it will only cause you serious grief. So you're on an anti-anxiety medication and still experiencing anxiety?!! Doesn't that tell you something? If not, then I will, it's all the sugar my friend. If you don't feel better on medicine even, it's the sugar and nothing can stop it other than the proper diet.
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Babouin
replied on June 20th, 2006
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There is some confusion about legumes. I read some books (including "hypoglycemia for dummies") which recommand eating legumes because they are high in complex carbs and very good nutrients. After checking on nutritiondata.Com, I sure realized that they are higher in carbs than what I thought, but still, I don't see why some legumes (high in complex carbs) with vegetables wouldn't make it.

The main problem I see is that if I avoid legumes I would mostly have to eat meat or eggs 3-4 times a day, which seem too much for me. I sure eat tofu, but as for legumes it gives me some awful gas... What I like about legumes is their versatility: I make a big bowl of chick peas/adzuki beans/lentils, mixed with garlic/ginger/onions and vegetables and can eat a fast meal anytime I need.

I sure understand that they need to be avoided at first, but... I have been on a low-carb diet for 1 year and a half now. Sure, in the last months I realized that my 'exceptions' were too frequent. I also realized that they were mainly the consequence of a binge eating disorder (which is more manageable since I started anti-anxiety medication) which at first I did not think had much consequence (in clear: I was mainly eating fat in my binges, thinking that it would be ok... But still, fat and some sugar and in huge quantity... I could eat like 750g. Of 8% yogurt 225ml. Whipped cream with strawberries and 250 g. Nuts all this in 1 hour or a bit more).

Anyway, back on the main subject. I will try to reduce eating legumes, but I am sorry to see that what I thought was a better alimentation for me seems to be a waste. I mean: I worked so hard to lose all this weight (and I still lost weight in the last months, which is rather confusing if I agree with the hypothesis that my hypoglycemia is linked to a relapse in my motivation and because of my binges). In other words: do I really need to start from scratch again? And what kind of a life is this if I must always avoid everything?

My step-father (no genetic involved) had hypoglycemia when in his 20s. He changed his alimentation, but he is able to eat pasta, bread, he was enjoying alcohol, etc. I would like to be able to enjoy a bit all those! I don't want to get drunk all the time, but I work in a liquor store you see so I need to be able to taste some wine to give advice to customers.

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i did not understand your reaction to the turkey... What do you mean? Is it simply a 'normal' reaction when you start the diet?

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i read a bit about ketosis... Http://academic.Sun.Ac.Za/medphys/ketosis. Htm

here is something interesting: "there is a small but real possibility, if you are regularly experiencing post- exercise ketosis, that your liver just cannot make enough glucose for your needs. (remember that ketone bodies are produced as a consequence of the gluconeogenic process. See: footnote.) when I was inducing post-exercise ketosis in the subjects for my research (healthy young students), a few of them would start to feel faint, sweaty and very unsteady on their feet about 6 hours after the exercise (they were allowed no food intake during those 6 hours). Their ketone bodies levels in the blood would then be sky high; but what was making them feel faint and dizzy were the low levels of glucose in the blood. Their livers were just not coping with the demand for glucose (despite just sitting around doing nothing - except watching videos - for those 6 hours after exercise). The treatment was simple: we just gave them a plateful of cake and muffins with lots of jam to eat. Within minutes the symptoms were gone, and when we tested the blood, ketone bodies could no longer be found, and their blood sugars would be normal."

i wonder if that could be my case. I know my liver is weak (i am a ex-functional alcoholic and ex-drug addict) and each time I play tennis it hurts for days. And even without exercise... Each time I used to eat sugar I felt better (i have joint/articulation/back pain... Something like fibromyalgia or I dont know... Remember that glucosamine, which is somehow a complex glucose, made me feel better?). For the last days, I have stopped to eat any pineapple or sugar. Only strawberries (so damn good those days) and low-carb. And guess what: my body hurts so much from top to toe... Yesterday I was unable to get asleep because of restless legs, painful articulations. I was feeling pain everywhere, and each time I cut back on carbs it gets worse. I don't understand why, but this is something clear to me: I probably used sugar as a medication for my pain. But now, without it, I feel terrible. And this, of course, increases my anxiety and my fear that I may faint again at job...

Not to talk about the facts that it seems I am constantly in hypoglycemia reaction some hours after eating those days...

So, I wonder, is it possible that my liver is simply unable to convert glucagon normally and so I physically need more carbs?

I nearly had an anticipatory anxiety attack yesterday in my bed. Was feeling so anxious for no particular reason, and my body was painful... I just fear to get back to work (i will work more often in july and august) as I feel hopeless right now about my symptoms.

A friend in a health food store told me to take chromium and adrenal bovince extract to "reeducate my adrenals". I am starting to believe that maybe the adrenal thing is not a good idea, as I feel like they are overreacting and shooting adrenaline and noradrenaline all the time!

Thanks for the chat!
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Stan
replied on June 20th, 2006
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Let me start off by saying something again that seems to be evident in everything you're writing. Listen to me. You're not going to feel good on this diet at first. It's going to feel worse. With good reason, your body is going into withdrawal. There is no way to avoid it in most cases. If you were lucky, you would start to feel pretty good in a short amount of time but I can tell based on your symptoms and general direction that you're going to feel like garbage, perhaps for a few weeks, before you start feeling better on the right diet. Get that in your head now if you want to continue. As to the things you've said:

1. I too had read that book and thought legumes were a good thing. I tried them for almost five months, and had almost no progress whatsoever. It continued to get worse and worse until I could hardly stand it. I don't know why, but legumes are awful at first. The hai diet doesn't explain why, but it's in there. I theorize it has to do with how fast they raise the blood sugar level. Of course, carbohydrate content matters too, if you're going for 100g a day, you can get like half of that with about one cup of beans. Don't eat them. If you don't listen you won't get better. Beans should never be too much of a diet staple, they remove nutrients from the body. Same thing for tofu, it's okay in moderation, but too much soy products (especially soy milk), will remove nutrients from your body because of it's high phytic acid content. It has the most of any type of bean (another reason to avoid all of them).


2. You don't have to eat that much meat or eggs. Instead, you want to get your carbohydrates from good vegetables, mainly greens like romaine lettuce, green beans or spinach. That's where the majority of your carbohydrates need to come from if you can't handle many nuts. Most varieties of squash are good for this too.

3. Many hypoglycemics have this "binge eating" thing. Apparently it's the brain attempting to get you to eat as much crap food as possible so it feels good quickly, regardless of the consequences. Hypoglycemics with this symptom find it disappears when they get in order, but it's one of the hardest ones to deal with. I had it occasionally, but I always pushed it aside.

4. Next thing. Listen to me and listen to me good. You will not be on this diet forever. The only things you will "always" need to avoid are anything made with white flour or white sugar. Usually alcohol too, but if you think life is meaningless without it, I suggest you look at life differently. Some hypoglycemics can handle it, others can't, but you won't know until you properly complete treatment. That means no mistakes for at least six months. None.

5. Along with that, you don't necessarly need to start from scratch again. It might be too much of a shellshock for your system right now. It's what I would do and exactly what I did, but it's up to you. You may want to gradually add stuff in and remove other things.

6. About losing weight. Have you ever, honestly, tried a higher fat diet while doing low carbohydrate? It would be exceedingly impossible for you to actually gain weight with that type of diet if you're working out as you say you are. Couldn't happen. I work out six days out of the week and have a toned and cut physique. Muscles run on one of two things, carbohydrates or fat. Take your pick, and whichever one you pick decrease your intake of the other or you will gain weight. This leads me to believe you're eating too many carbohydrates. It's just impossible to gain weight on a ketogenic diet, won't happen.

7. I really can't explain the turkey thing. To this day I don't know what happened. Before that I had occasionally eaten turkey skin for fat, but that one time just a small piece drove my body nuts. I have no clue why, I only assume it had something to do with my body changing since my diet changed. That's the only answer I have. Perhaps there was bacteria on it or something, I really don't know.

8. The liver does not make glucose, per se, it creates it from other things. Anyway, if you're experiencing this it's because of one thing. First, too many carbohydrates are draining your system. Thus, your liver doesn't have enough glucose stored up to realease into your system when it gets low. This is why a high fat diet is so good. If you work out a lot, once your system gets used to it it's ideal. You'll never get fatigued and the muscles use up the fat instead of storing it. Any excess is just let loose out of the body.

9. Your body hurts all over because it's in withdrawal. Skipping sugar has just proven that hypoglycemia is most likely your main problem. You need to follow the diet properly. I don't see how you're experiencing anxiety on medication. How high is the dosage? If it helps you, you may want to try another type or possibly increase the dosage until you get better, you're letting this get to you too much. Don't do anything with the medication before talking to your doctor though, don't ever do that. I would from time to time let it get to me but I always kept going because it would disappear in a few hours and become a thing of the past. You don't need more carbohydrates. Trust me you don't because I thought this myself at first until I got used to the diet and suddenly I found myself more energetic and healthy than ever.

10. I will say this though, some people have had luck on high carbohydrate diets. Emphasis on some, because it isn't many. If you want to try it, go ahead, i'm not stopping you, but I did warn you. If you really think you need more, go ahead, eat as many as you like and decrease protein and fat intake to see what happens. I'll be a large sum you'll be back in no more than a month to say it didn't work. I'd be surprised if it did. Up to you though, but you should also know that if high carbohydrates will work for you, it will take up to six months to even notice any change, whereas on my type of diet you notice changes within a week. Keep that in mind.

11. Try as hard as you can to remember that the anxiety and everything surrounding it (obsessions about work, symptoms, etc.) is all caused by the sugar. When you realize this, truly realize it, you'll be able to handle the lows much better and treatment will go even faster. Unfortunately, this is something that has to occur within you. If you're thinking of chromium, I suggest brewer's yeast, it has it in there as well as tons of amino acids and such, I use it for body building, but it's also good for hypoglycemics. All that i've read and others i've talked to noticed a change upon a week or so after trying it. That's the only supplement I recommend other than the calcium tabs i've talked about before. Everything else should not be taken in isolation, really not good for the body.
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DianaJJ
replied on June 20th, 2006
Experienced User
Hi,

i tried that "adrenal bovine extract" and had a horrible reaction. It was like I was injected with adrenaline! I had the worst panic attack ever....Rapid heartbeat, a feeling of panic, shaking, dizzy, etc. Maybe i'm just sensitive but be careful. I don't think the chromium is harmful but stan is right, the brewer's yeast has alot in it plus other good nutrients for hypoglycemia.

Dj
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tygrbabi
replied on June 20th, 2006
Experienced User
Years ago my doctor told me no legumes unless it was fresh or I soaked dried beans overnight and change the water three times. He said that dried beans contained a higher concentration of carbs just like dried fruit is a no-no. Too much sugar in it.

Then, I could have beans on occassion, maybe 2-3 times a month. But I got carried away. As for rice, only brown. As for pasta, only pasta made with semolina. But once you abuse anything, you get adverse effects. Moderation is key. Now here I am, on stan's diet just because I became too lax about what I could eat.

As for the brewer's yeast, what brand do you guys use?
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Stan
replied on June 20th, 2006
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I use lewis labs. It's the best one I think. I actually soaked my beans, didn't seem to make any difference.
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