Fatty Infiltration (Page 1)

Fatty infiltration of both the liver and pancreas is common with aging and obesity. I'm an ultrasound student and about 75% of people I scan over 40 have this condition. Fatty infiltration is a reversible process. It is most often caused by obesity, alcohol abuse, or starvation, along with many other causes. The other doctor who said you should have a ct is an idiot. It's because of doctors like those why we have many patients getting time consuming exams which could be given to patients who are truly in need.
Like your first doctor said, just watch what you eat, lower your cholesterol and you'll be fine.

I think the "Fool" is a "Student" giving medical advice! Professional Nurse here of over 15 years! i HATE when someone with NO experience (other then a few clases at a community college) try to critique a medical professional opinion which is CLERLY out of their league! you learn how to "TAKE PICTURES"
NOT to treat NOT to diagnose! I have a 6 year degree and even I can't diagnose! Check yourself there skippy! Your not as educated as you think you are...and no where close to a medical Doctor!

PS there is no long line at the hospitals of people waiting to get ct scans! everyone who needs one, get's one!

If your Dr wants a CT scan there is good reason! GET THE SCAN! it is a tool used to rule out disease process, don't listen to an Ultra sound student!

Not trying to be rude, but COME ON! HUGE difference between an M.D. and a sonographer

FOOL!

WOW excuse me while i finish laughing.
Where do I even begin with all of the things wrong with your post NURSE...
First of all... this is an open forum. People come here for the opinions of EVERYONE, or else they would have posted this question to the doctor. Second of all.. this post was made almost 3 years ago. Clearly you are just nit picking and trying to start fights. Maybe you should get a life and/or take the pickle out of your bum and actually try to answer questions that may help people.
And since when is a 4.5 year degree in Medical Radiation Sciences and a diploma in Diagnostic Medical Imaging considered community college? Last i checked those two things are a tad different. I have been scanning for over 3 years now. Yes we take images but we also have to know what we are looking at as well as the disease processes that can affect the areas we scan. You think RADIOLOGISTS scan all the patients? NO. They trust what we see and what we tell them to make their reports. So in a way, yes we do help diagnose, as part of diagnostic imaging...wow go figure.
I still see fatty infiltration in livers and pancreas on a daily basis and no it is still not a medical emergency. It still does NOT require a CT scan. Yes i will still call a physician who orders a CT scan over a fatty liver or fatty pancreas a fool, and i'm sure the radiologist would agree with me as well. Sure there are other disease processes that can affect the pancreas and liver but if it is only fatty infiltration, CT is not neccessary. Physicians make mistakes too you know. AKA the ones who ask us to rule out gb stones in a patient with NO gb. And what do physicians do when they haven't heard of something (usually look it up or ask a colleague) but not always, many order a CT ofcourse just to cover their behinds.
Maybe wherever you live there isn't a waiting time for a CT but here there is. And i would sure as hell be pissed off to know i had a CT scan and that HIGH radiation dose for something as simple as a fatty liver or pancreas.
So you can say whatever you like NURSE. I will continue to critique doctors i work with, and doctors who's patients i scan. Are you going to stop me? nope. I take what i do very seriously, and i am good at it. Many radiologists would agree with me.
And yes, you are trying to be rude. You know what i can be rude too, ie. could tell you to go "wipe some more poopy bums, because that's really all a nurse does" but i'm not as ignorant as you. Unlike you i have respect for other people in the medical field including nurses (except for foolish ones like yourself). So please get off your high horse and move on.

Although you both seem to be antagonistic to each other, I think you can both contribute with your training & experience. I do think it is ill-advised to tell a person NOT to get a CT scan or that a doctor is a fool for ordering one, based on a paragraph synopsis of their medical history though. Their doctor may well have something else in the history/exam that makes him think this scan is necessary. Not up to ANYONE to object to that when such limited info is given in a post. Even the doctors who respond here would not do that. Fine to say the fatty infiltration is common, but not fine to say diagnostic tests already ordered are unnecessary. Step back from your egos and let us all benefit from BOTH of your experience & educations! I hold both techs AND nurses in high regard. You all are doing a critical job in the health care industry. No need for the chest-thumping.

Gosh I don't know where to start...

I haven't wipped a "Poopy bum" since Nursing school, I am a "Professional Nurse" and the Director of Nursing for a clinic at that...

You call ME ignorant!? Your giving medical advice that is WELL outside of YOUR scope of practice!

I don't give it, and neither should YOU!

I have MUCH MORE respect for other medical professionals then YOU do! I KNOW my role in the field, YOU HOWEVER are trying to practice OUTSIDE OF YOURS!
This may be an open forum, but that does NOT give you card blanc to give ill advice that YOU are NOT trained to do...

and you weren't really showing much respect to Nurses whith that comment either, Nurses do a HELL of a lot more then that and YOU KNOW IT! You sound a bit bitter with physcians in general...Couldn't get into medical school?

Your education PALES in comparison to mine!

Those who can do, those who can't become sonographers!

The medical advice i give isn't outside of my practice at all. It is actually quite relevant to my practice or else i wouldn't give it. If people have a question about ultrasound, or other diagnostic imaging modalities, i share my information.
If you don't give medical advice then why are you on this site? I am well trained to give the advice which i provided to this person. Do you know anything about fatty livers? maybe you should go read up on some and see what the info says before you criticize my advice.
And i do know that nurses work very hard but seeing how you can make a low blow and assume that sonographers just "take pictures" i thought i'd give you a taste of your own medicine. If you don't understand a profession, don't criticize it.
I'm not bitter towards physicians, i just know that they aren't all perfect, like you are assuming. No i didn't apply to med school and had no plans to do so. I was accepted to several nursing schools however, but chose sonography. I like the fact that we learn MUCH more pathology.
How does my education PALE in comparison to yours? examples please? i have a degree too you know.
Those who can do what? can't what? please try making some sense.. I became a sonographer because i wanted to, and enjoy it very much. Maybe you should look into what a sonographer actually does before bashing it. That shows your ignorance quite well i'd say.
I can't imagine YOU do much as a nurse, if you haven't wiped a bum since nursing school. Maybe you need to get your hands dirty?

I did get my hands dirty for almost 20 years! I think you said you've been doing this for 3!

I stumbled upon this site as I TOO have a fatty pancreas and liver and was seeking more information about it...I know what I know, and admit what I don't! I am VERY familiar with fatty liver (pancreas, not so much)

My Sonographer HOWEVER didn't AND COULDN'T talk to me about any of the pictures! he told me it was up to my Doctor to disguss it with me, not him... That an MD would be reading the scans and making the diagnosis (that's how I KNOW this is NOT YOUR JOB!) on top of I have an associates, Bachelor, and Masters degree in Science and Nursing, am 2 semesters away from being a P.A. and have worked in the hospital setting for almost 20 years!

THIS IS HOW I KNOW THAT YOU SHOULD NOT BE GIVING MEDICAL ADVICE!! AND ARE NOT QUALIFIED TO DO SO...

You may get an ocassional "Hey what's this look like to you?" from a Doc, but YOUR NOT THE ONE MAKING LIFE AND DEATH DECISIONS, YOUR NOT THE ONE DIAGNOSING, TREATING, OR PERSCRIBING...

Lets not get it twisted!!!

If an M.D. orders a ct scan, he should NOT be called a fool! Esp from someone with so little experience!

You must be confused.
I never said that it is MY JOB to deliver a diagnosis to my patients. I don’t say anything regarding the images to a patient unless advised to do so by a radiologist, and I take this very seriously. You think your sonographer had no clue what he was looking at or what pathology you had when he was scanning you? Sonographers run differential diagnoses through their heads constantly. That is their job.
What I do at my job is COMPLETELY different from posting opinions on an open PUBLIC FORUM. All kinds of people give advice on this website, they aren’t all physicians you know. Why aren’t you on their case? Many of them have no background in health care what so ever. People who take the advice on this website should do so with their own discretion. Do I have more knowledge about ultrasound and related pathology than the general public? You bet, and that’s what I provide here whether it be factually based, or opinion based.
And it’s not an occasional “what’s this look like to you?” I present and discuss EVERY case with the radiologist. No I don’t make life/death decisions. But whether you agree or not, I do have a role in the diagnosis, that is my job. I may have less experience than you, but I still do my job very well.
So did your doctor tell you to get a CT scan right away? I highly doubt it. The patient clearly said that her doctor ordered the CT because she had never heard of fatty pancreas. You and I both know this is not a responsible action of an MD at all. Maybe the doctors in the US (or wherever you’re from, maybe even Canada) order CT scans like nothing at all because it is so readily available. The doctors around here only ask for CT if it is truly necessary. I’m sure you know CT has a lot of radiation, and should not just be done for no good reasons, that’s how the professionals here feel anyway.
This argument is just getting silly. If you want more info on fatty pancreas I’d be pleased to discuss but please stop wasting time with “I’m so experienced, sonographers know nothing, you know nothing, you’re not a doctor” blah blah blah.

Agree'd...

It really wasn't you giving advice that bothered me soooo much as you calling an M.D. a fool....

It just rubbed me the wrong way...

I will also tell you I have a very bad taste in my mouth for medical professionals that I feel are praticing outside their scope...

Mostly EMT's HERE (I am assuming you are somewhere in the U.K.) here in the US we have a BIG problem with EMT's (whom by the way have a total of about 6 weeks of school) trying to diagnose, and treat as apossed to stablizing and transporting as they are supposed to do...

So I may have taken my anger out on you AND underestimated your level of education, and for that I apologize...

My Doctor did NOT order a ct scan (yet) lol
in fact...I have yet to meet with him after my scan... My intial visit was to rule out DVT as my LLE had + 3 pitting edema, he ordered a dopler of my LLE and RUQ (I overheard the techs talking about my liver being fatty, and pancreas too) When I asked them about it, they told me my Dr. would have to consult with me, that they couldn't...

Not much info out there, other then lose weight fat ass! ha ha ha....Which I am doing! have lost 20 pounds, and am now on HCTZ the edema is gone in my LLE, so we'll see...

I'm sorry for the insults, you were correct in that I was just wanting to start a fight, I was...I took my frustrations out on you...

Peace...

Ed

Not trying to impose here but,I stumbled upon this site looking for information about fatty pancreas' and their treatment/threat. In here I find an informative reply from someone, followed by an argument from a nurse that apparently failed all English courses due to a complete lack of spelling ability. How you write and how you talk show a lot of how intelligent you are. You have multiple capital letters where no capitals should be, your grammar is completely wrong, and several words are misspelled. For Christ's sake, this forum has spell check, use it and maybe I could believe your opinion on the matter at hand. Or, use this professional schooling you pride yourself with and be polite and learn when to turn a blind eye. Though, for all that, I could very well be wrong because, apparently I am an idiot since I have no degree other than one from a community college.

Fedup.1

I have got elevated LFTs, Ultrasound that explained poor result due to patients mobility ( Rhuematoid Arthritis & Spa ) however it did pick up fatty liver & what could be seen of the Pancreas was also fatty. I am on an overwhelming amount of drugs for 8 conditions. I have taken many different meds for 16 years. I have had upper abdominal bloating, nausea, fatigue, some pain for 6 weeks now. I am overweight. I am fairly immobile but can walk with assistance 20 metres. I am on Methotrexate, Celebrex, Mabthera, and much more. I will speak to my Doctors on Monday but I was trying to find out some info before hand. I have an extremely complex medical history but I would like to know if any person out there actually understands. I do understand that Methotrexate can cause Liver damage as well as many other drugs I have been on. I don't understand how in 3 years my Liver & Pancreas were clear and now they are fatty. I did lose 30kgs but have put about 10 back on. Help!

homeopathy will help you in Rheumatoid arthritis and liver disorder and you can have qualitative life.

I tend to agree with ProfessionalNurse2 - it's beyond the remit of an ultrasonographer to offer advice on medical conditions. The original answer should really have finished with "I'm an ultrasound student and about 75% of people I scan over 40 have this condition".

It is up to the patient's doctor to make decisions regarding further care, and if they feel a CT is warranted, they're probably right. (Although the international medical community recognises that CT may be overused in North America at present).

Best wishes

Hey, ProfessionalNurse2, For somebody with a Masters Degree and a soon to be P.A. your spelling sucks. I hope you paid more attention in your nursing classes than you did in your english class. As for bad mouthing EMS, ask yourself this. If I'm ever in a bad wreck or my heart screws up or I become a victim of a crime, whos going to help me or risk their life for me? The nurse that works in a clean sterile environment all day or the EMT with 6 wks of schooling who is probably trying to get into nursing or medical school? We all start at the bottom, you need to remember that.

About the CT exam ordered, rather than being scared about it, I think it's probably better to ask the doctor what are his reasons for ordering the scan (since you already have it diagnosed).

He may have his reasons, so I don't think it's fair to conclude that he's over-investigating (and a no good for nothing doctor)

Bruce

Can I mediate? I'd be happy to hear a radiographers opinion my my radiology results! I think professional nurse is objecting to HOW you gave you opinion not WHAT your opinion was. Saying "I don't see any reason for the CT" is better than calling doctors fools.

I have a question of my own, I had an ultrasound 4 months ago and have fatty liver and pancreas, I'm 38 and was diagnosed diabetic type 2 when I was 35. Doc said the fatty pancreas probably causes diabetes. Is is possible to lose weight and lose the fat on my pancreas thereby restoring function to my pancreas? Reversing Diabetes? I know it's a long shot but wouldn't that be awesome.

So many rabble rousers. Now, back to topic. Any of you may find that males over 40 and some sooner, have testosterone levels below 450 ng/dl with no free testosterone will develop (among other complications) fatty infusions into the Liver causing skin problems noticeably, and fatty infusion into the pancreas causing insulin resistance. If shots are given to bring the testosterone level ABOVE 450 ng/dl, then within three to six months the midriff bulge, the fatty infusion of the Liver & Pancreas will vanish.

I found the professional nurse's comment regarding EMT's interesting. While it is true EMT's and Paramedics do stabilize and transport they do a lot more as well. In fact in order to become one, you need more than 6 weeks of training. In fact, I challange her to find a 6 week course.. As a paramedic of 20 years, I have seen the training required go from 8 months of 8-5 7 day a week training, to include field time and in hospital time, to a full-fledge 2 year degree. As for what we are responsible for, well that includes making everything short of an official diagnosis, administering appropriate medications, stabilizing the patient and doing everything the ED can do in the first 20 minutes. The medication list I am responsible for includes 50 different medications, everything from narcotics to anti-nausea medications, benadryl, cardiac drips, etc. We start IV's, draw blood, do 12-leads and interpret them, intubate, treat major Heart attack and stroke victims,treat major trauma victims, and yes we even make house calls. All of this in what sometimes is an upside down car in a ditch or someone's house. I don't have a cushy office or a nice clean patient to work with in a nice clean room in a nice clean hospital. We are licensed and regulated by the appropriate state and most of us our credentialed at the national level. So, please don't make disparaging remarks about a professional specialty you know nothing about.

Rromsmate; where did you get the info about the testosterone level?

i was just told I have a fatty pancreas and liver and was also looking for info on it. My doctor didn't seem to know much about it, other than to have me come back for a followup in 3 months.

Ah, thus we find the root of the problem. Did I get the age range correct? I assume so. No, doctors cannot give you the information I did because Testosterone is assumed to be merely a natural steroid. But the molecule has so many other receptor sites. From the Herbal side of the fence, the information I gave is accurate. It is just like Neuropathy. Doctors say "no cure, the feet will have to come off eventually."