no one denies it's alive. Personhood matters because it's the concept by which rights are conferred, it matters because that human is now an independant and existing by it's own right.



if it doesn't matter then why can you not use the correct terms (i.E zygote/embryo/fetus)?
It's nothing about the degree of "human - ness" of the fetus, it's about the .W.O.M.A.N




i don't say that, however, surely you are aware that the fetus cannot survive .W.I.T.H.O.U.T thw womans body. It needs her body to exist



because sex doesn't automatically mean pregnancy, because contraception fails



homicide applies to persons, it applies to those who do not need anothers body to even exist. If the woman doesn't want to host the pregnancy for 9months then there .I.S a reason why it cannot be carried to term - pregnancy isn't all about the fetus you know


no

You coverd everything that I would say :)

to most sane people personhood makes no difference, which is why there will always be objections to things like abortion and slavery [ slaves were classed as none persons ]




to dehumanize the fetus, the only place I have heard it called a fetus, embryo or zygote is from pro choicers, in 37 years and 8 pregnancys I have never heard it called them names in the real world only on the net by pro choice.



it is part of her body but that alone does not give them the right to have that child killed, can I kill someone because they are living in my house claiming benefits off my tax, they are living off me and could not live without me, so can I kill them.?





contraception is not 100% effective and has for abstinence, never going to happen, better contraception and free and available contraception, better sex ed would be a bloody start.





no abortion is nice, whether elective or because of medical problems, some are needed, not all life is worth living, certain pain and short life are they worth putting the child through, when it would be kinder for that child to go whilst it has no sense of pain.




sorry but religion has no part in abortion debate, you has a catholic should know that to each individual the bible means different things, has different answers to each persons problems, so can be used for both sides.

wrong, it has nothing to do with "dehumanizing" the fetus, it's about using the correct terms and not manipulating words to aid your cause. Yes, most people will call their fetus a baby before it's born, I called my fetus peanut - it wasn't a peanut anymore than it is a baby but people do attach emotion to their fetuses.


you could kick them out of your house, just as I can remove a fetus from my body. If the person cannot survive without your house it is not your problem.


agreed (although contraception is free here sex ed needs to be drastically improved)

there is the perfect example of what I was saying, why did you give it a special name when you were pregnant yet when arguing for it to be aborted you dehumanize it.

i was saying that just because someone attaches emotion to the fetus doesn't make it anything other than a fetus (and it's not about "dehumanizing" it, it's about leaving the emotion away and acknowledging what it is)

(and I don't have children, btw)

yet you said this



so my sympathys on your loss, was it a miscarrage.

I have had one miscarriage and one abortion

one was natural and one was deliberate.

yes. Did I say different???


the miscarriage

one was natural and one was deliberate.

yeah, i'd like to see that. Join me in ignoring him like I did jillian? It worked; and the two of us actually agree on things now.

how about we ignore the two biggest shytestirrers on here you and the freak bahahaha123, just how many times do you lot need to attack and try to immaturely insult someones belief, when you two grow up to accept other people do not want to hear your hate filled messages then maybe just maybe you will get to debate, I doubt you will ever be mature enough.By the way eiri religious hatred is now illegal so watch your potty mouth.

hahah .X.D

i don't hate christians silly, you all hate me! So! Why don't you be careful, hmn?

i don't even think bhaha's married, or has children.

you need to shut up, you fucking sick whore! Both of you! You're fucking disgusting!! I don't give a sh*t who's right or wrong! You both need to have more respect for your own children, and for others!

Talking about child molestation, rape, incest; I don't care if you're trying to "out-insult" each other. If your children ever saw any of this, they'd be scarred for life.

Wake up to what the hell you're doing.

one thing I am not a christian and I have yet to see anyone post hatefilled posts accusing your priests of raping children or calling all buddists psycho hate filled names like you have, so there is religious intolerance and inciting religious hatred by you, but from the other posts where your sick twisted have sex wit friend accused me of all sorts you said nothing, you just let it ride but oh boy when my wife started back at her you defended her and attacked my wife doing it scumbag hypocrite.

Would you say that those priests who molested those boys were real priests? Truly devoted to the ideals of christianity?

True buddhism is appaled at these things; and true buddhism doesn't promote abstaining from sex or the complete suppression of all desires. These are fringe groups, just like there are crazy fringe christians. True buddhism is about moderation and the discovery of the truth in the world. These are crazy people, burning babies in the name of buddha, kind of like the christians sent children out in the crusades in the name of god.

Nice muckraking, but your past is as soiled as mine. True buddhism says homicide is wrong, so these priests are violating one of our prime rules. Buddhists do not believe necrophelia is right, nor is rape, or "magic rituals". We are as against magic rituals as you can get,without being agnostic. Ceremony and ritual are useless fluff that clouds one's mind to what the religion is really about, which is questioning everything.

There are bad people in every religion.

On an off note, I didn't notice any raping of little boys in there.

murder is a greater crime then rape.

Murder is the biggest and most destructive of sins, almost every religion acknowledges this.

And I notice the buddhist priests committed these crimes.


End of argument.