I am sorry, I am going to be blunt, and straight to the topic.

Are you kidding me?...Who the hell diagnosed a 5 year old with bipolar???...A person, I hope!
Do you want your child to live well?...Good!...Get him off all the junk medication he is on, take all the pop away from his diet, right now!...He is to drink water, not juice, not pop! His weight, divided by two, in ounces, is as much water as he needs everyday!...So, if he is 40 lbs, divided by two is 20, in ounces, so, he would need 20 ounces of water a day, got it?
Now, another pertinent question, when was he vaccinated last?...There must have been a vaccination there, and I bet he is suffering from side-effects!...Welcome to the real world. If so, it needs to be antidoted.
Another point, he needs fish oils, and soon!
If you take this message serious enough, you could email me, and I will talk to you further about it. He can be treated, really fast and effectively, in a matter of a few months, but you need to act now, take charge, and stop listening to the doctors you are listening to!...Really!
Good luck!

Well thank you for that post which goes to show you are not a doctor, my son doesn't drink any pop. He drinks milk, sugar free koolaid and water his last shots were when he turned five and he will be six in april. I have been to over three psychologists who have tested him to make sure. Trust me I don't like having my son on medication to help him. Yet while I say that his grades in school have improved, he no longer attacks his younger sister and he is calmer then he has ever been. His father has bipolar also and refuses to go on medication to help him so I know what can happen to my son if he doesn't get the help now that he needs his father is in prison and has no chance of getting out. I thank you for concern, yet I was asking other mothers who are going threw what i'm going threw to respond. But again thank you.

M-k

Hello again,

well, I am indeed a doctor, and I work with children a lot, mostly with neurological disorders, including autism and cerebral palsy!
First, 5 year olds cannot have bipolar disorder!!!!...There brains are not even developed, yet!...So, I have to tell you his problem is somenting else.
But if you insist to agree with the 3 psichologists, then go ahead, do what they tell you, and good luck!
It will be interesting to see how many other mothers respond to your query?!...I am personally interested in learning from other cases!
By the way, koolaid is pop, no matter how you look at it. Anyway, did not want to leave your comment unattended. Be well, and good luck. I am sorry you are facing such a difficult case.

Hi there. I am also new to this forum. I am not a doctor, but I can sympathise with you and your son. I have 3 children of my own. My 8 year old was diagnosed with adhd and a mood disorder at the age of 5, though his psych. Has consistently raised the possibility that he may have bipolar. Currently he is on strattera and terazadone, and has recently been precribed risperdal, though has not started that particular med. Yet. He has been on several (the most effective combination was straterra and zyprexa combination but the insurance companies do not like to cover these meds for children under 12)..Anyway, I understand your frustration. In terms of discipline, I can say that dealing with a child like this is not easy..I gave up spanking when he was 2..It was ineffective and only made problems worse. Time-out (in the traditional sense) is also not effective..Mostly, I have found that speaking to him very firmly and matter-of-factly, but in a calm tone of voice helps a lot...I try to pick my battles very carefully..Those issues with high importance (fighting with siblings, dangerous behaviors, etc. ) are dealt with immediately by separating him from the rest of us (usually in his room, where he is able to calm down) and then we spend time talking about what is going on. The more annoying-type behaviors are dealt with by ignoring him when possible,as they are mostly done out of seeking attention. I have found, that when I need to give consequences, they are in smaller increments...For example, if he is all wound up and not staying in bed at night, I will first give him a warning and then he loses 10 min. Of play time the next day..When behavior continues, I add 10 min. Per time...Sometimes he will end up grounded for an entire afternoon; others with only 10 min...This seeems to have been the most effective type of discipline as he still has a chance to "redeem" himself..And he has made progress this way..I hope this helps..
Here is a website I have found particularly helpful:
juvenile bipolar research foundation http://www.Bpchildresearch.Org/juv_bipolar /index.Html
you can also do a search on juvenile bipolar or early onset bipolar disorder that will offer many articles/websites dealing with this very thing...Good luck to you.. :)

I would like to thank you for your message since I have last been on here my son had a allergic reaction to his tegretol and we have had to put him on lithium soo maybe that might still help him. Anyother parents who would like to share their stories, like anttm04 has stated not alot of programs are avaliable to parents of bi-polar children. Well untill next time thank you again anttm04 at least i'm not alone.

No, m-k, you sure aren't alone..It sure feels that way though, doesn't it? I hope your little one is feeling better with the med. Switch...My boy's psychiatrist has spoken of putting him on lithium or depakote, but I am not quite ready for that step (especially given that his is not confirmed as bipolar yet)..Please let me know how your child does on the lithium...I am so afraid of that..We also have the problem that my sons metabolism seems to be unusually high, so we are having to raise the doseage on his meds more often than I am comfortable with...And the side effects are often uncomfortable for him...We had success with the strattera and zyprexa combination...Since he's been on the trazadone, he seems to have gone into a (mainly) manic stage..Frustrating!!!! His teacher is even noticing behavior changes in school. So, we are currently having some significant difficulties...Please let me know of any strategies that you have for dealing with the behaviors that go along with this..I am running out of ideas (i jokingly told his case manager that I was going to end up needing medication before we get him okay again)..Anyway, it's comforting to know that someone out there knows what I am going through as well... :d

My son was also on strattera yet it seemed not in the bit to help him then my sons doctor stated to me that my son was on the short acting and he needed to be on a longer medication strattera was only working for about 3-4 hours thats when we discussed putting him on adderall xr, 15 milligrams is all that he is taking and it is working for about 10 hours a day I know there was a huge difference in my son within the first week of taking adderall but I know it is a combnation of the other medications also that he is taking. But I though maybe allowing you to know that strattera didn't work for my son because it wasn't a extended release tablet might help you out let me know if anything changes. As for the behavior my son has done a 180 i'm able to talk to him now when he is upset where as before he would spit, kick and throw stuff at me. He is able to calm himself better also he is no longer fighting at school and has started to get along with his 3 year old sister better. Let me know how everything is going ok.
M-k

Hi again...My son has been on the strattera now since he was 5 or 6..They had him started on clonadine, but it made him cry all day long..His psych said she doesn't believe he can handle the stimulant drugs and so strattera has been a life saver for us...It improved dramatically with the zyprexa, but they won't put him on that anymore..They tried seroquel, which worked kind of, but took him off that too...Now they have prescribed risperdol but it has yet to go through...Did your son suffer any side effects with the risperdol? I'm asking, only because the psych. Also prescribed a med. To counteract the side effects of risperdol..I guess it can make the child get real shaky for a while, so I was a bit nervous about that one too..For a while he was doing great mood and behavior-wise..No problems (or few, anyway) in school..He's never really gotten into fights and all in school and he's really gentle with animals and children who are smaller than he is...But since he started on the trazadone, he's become absolutely impossible to deal with..Has to argue/fight with anyone who disagrees with him, lies like crazy, cannot complete anything (school, chores, projects, etc), fights with his brother and sister all the time and the tantrums are back..Nothing is ever his fault..He's almost become "paranoid" like everyone is out to get him into trouble...Etc...His teacher is even noticing changes in him at school...So, I am worried..I want to take him off the trazadone, but without it, he can't sleep (he's never been a good sleeper)..Without it, he may only sleep 3 or 4 hours a night and then be miserable throughout the day...Sometimes I just want to take him off of everything but that isn't an option at this point (he was off for several months last year and showed signs of suicidal ideation..I almost had him hospitalized after a straight 2-hour screaming tantrum!)...Anything, thanks for listening... :)

Alex is on risperdal now and I don't really see any effects, to counter that he was put on tegretal that helped him at night, he would finally fall asleep at 9:00-9:30 instead of 12:00-12:30. Yet he had a reaction to that and that is when we put him on lithium. I'm still waiting for the insurance to approve that. Alex was at the stage of it being everyone elses fault at school home ect.. Now he is more open to admit his own faults and tell what happened instead of the he or she started it. He once bit a girl at school once for not giving him the toy he wanted yet all that has changed with his medication. Well hope this helps a bit my sons doctor gave me a website to research all the medications he was given if you would like the site it is Risperdal it kinda helped me with side effects ect... Well hope you have a good day/ evening.

M-k

This whole med. Management thing has gotten crazy already..Last night when we went to pick up trey's prescription for risperdal (which was approved more than a week ago..I held off because he's been on antibiotics for an ear infection), the pharmacy has said that it hasn't gone through there yet and that it's not fda approved for children his age (he's 8)...Oh boy...The psychiatrist is asking me to have a psychological evaluation done for him so that she can make a diagnosis one way or the other, so I spent several hours on the phone fri. To locate a psychologist to do the eval...We've hit somewhat of a dead end there..Even his case manager is coming up empty...He's supposed to be starting back with counseling soon, but not sure exactly when..And I am still not able to find any kind of support group for dealing with this...It doesn't appear that there is much in the way of mental health support in my area, especially when it comes to children with problems....I think the reason that it is so frustrating is because I can see what this is doing to him and not being able to help is excruciating...In the meantime he is getting worse just as fewer answers are to be found..Have you had anything similar or is mental health better in your area? The psych. Prescribed benztropine to go along with the risperdol, for the side effects...That, interestingly went through, though he won't start that til he starts the risperdal (if it ever does get approved)...I've actually asked that if they are having problems with getting the risperdol approved, and if they have to approve something in that class of meds, that they try to go for the zyprexa because he did very well with that one..Relatively few side effects and mood was stable...I hope all goes well with your little one...Does the risperdal help him sleep? Or does he not have sleeping problems? I would like to be able to take mine off of the trazadone at some point (soon, if possible)..Anyway, take care.. :)

The first psychiatrist my son was supposed to see canceled on us 4 times in a row thats when I hit my limit, it was offered threw a center that was well known. So I found out there were only one other place I could take my son, in the town I live in if not there then I would have to take him a hour away to get help thankfully the center for psychology has come threw for us his counselor is great and his doctor is even better I stay in contact with his doctor every week about progress and downfalls. I understand about the medication alex was on strattera and couldn't get the adderall untill the doctor himself called to get it done. The best thing about alexs doctor is he handles all the medication calls to our pharmacy. My son had sleeping problems he would stay up till 12-1 am when he had school in the morning really taken a toll on me. Since he started his risperdal he is sleeping by 9:30-10:00 but what stinks about that is I can no longer keep him up for the movies on friday and saturday nights cause he has to take it at 8:00 pm every night. Well I feel for you I know how frustrating it is I know our local hospital has help for adults with bipolar yet with children it is still a no no to allow a child and parent to get support. Like the other writer wrote no way can a child have bipolar well sad to say it happens and its about time people are aware of this and parents and children get the help the badly need.
Keep the faith i'm here also and we can do this :)
missy (m-k)

Hi missy..Thank you so much for your reply..I am here for you too whenever you need to chat/vent, etc...It's comforting to know that there is someone out there in my situation...Where are you, if you don't mind my asking? I am in fla. And it seems like there is just nothing for mental health support...Especially for children..It makes me a little more at ease thatyour son has done okay on risperdal..It doesn't appear likely that we'll be able to get the risperdal..I am really pushing for the zyprexa, if possible, as he was on that before and did wonderfully on it...I really don't want to try the lithium or depakote yet...The psych told me that if we put him on one of those he would have to have frequent blood testing...Trey absolutely hates needles and he is very strong for a boy his age....I cannot hold him when he is in panic mode, so my husband has to do the blood work ups with him (my son can literally knock me down when he is being irrational and I am not a small person)..Right now we are trying to work on behavior management...Getting him to follow directions when asked, etc...And being respectful (which has lately ust about gone through the window!! As I said before, he has been somewhat manic since he started on the trazadone...I am really afaid for him because as he grows, if things dont' get better, he may not be able to control himself and may actually hurt someone..And it absolutely destroys him when he actually does (once the raging stops and all)...Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on the way you look at it), we are on medicaid..I have been a stay at home mom with the kids since they were tiny but finished my bachelor's degree in elementary education in may..Just having difficulty getting a job at the moment...Anyway, the whole medicaid system has changed drastically over the past year and has made it difficult for him to get the meds he needs...They tried cutting him off of strattera last month (i nearly lost it then)..Suggested that we try ritalin/adderal...He cannot handle stimulants at all!!! Anyway, they got it approved for the rest of the month, for now..We'll see what next month brings..Let me know how all is doing with you and yours and good luck to you with the lithium..Tracy

Putting any child on brain chemical changing medications
(especially that young) shows you are not a mother fit to make decisions for the basic health of her son. Sorry, its a slap in the face, but horrible.

He'll be messed up forever.

Its not bipolar, its spoiled.
:roll:

once again, demonstrating borel's theorem hasn't worked to date.

By the way "it" is used inappropriately in this sentence, as "it" is a child. The word you are searching for is "he".

But you keep on typing danmarkas, if you are immortal and given an infinite amount of time, you will produce hamlet.

Thank you for that well informed information. I'm honestly abit tired of people stating to me that it is my fault that my son has a chemical imbalance and to call me unfit is taking it abit over the edge. My sons father I believe is bi-polar and is in prison for the rest of his life, now would I rather take the chance of getting my son help now or allowing him to become like his father. Well allowing him to be like his father then you would blame me for doing nothing when I saw his behavior decreasing. So take your pick honestly you dont know my son and what he is capable of doing to family,friends and animals. And then to call him spoiled is soo far from the truth also. My son has a bed and a dresser in his room because he has destroyed everything else that I have gotten him. When you live one day in my shoes then you can judge me and my child untill then you are allowed your opinion but i'm stating facts.

I have news for you sir, or madam, or whatever you may be..It's rather quite obvious that you a) don't have children of your own b) you don't have children with mental health issues or c) you have a child or children with mental health issues and are in denial..What ever your probelm is...Until you have walked in my shoes or in the shoes of one like me, you have no clue as to what you are talking about...We are not dealing with your typical spoiled child..Whiny because he/she is used to getting his/her own way..At least in my case, we are talking about a child who has had serious difficulties in his life (outside of simply behavior) almost from birth...Pregnancy was difficult at best, he did nothing but scream for the first year of his life..He has been climbing and jumping off of (dangerously high) things since he was able to walk...At the age of 4 had dental surgery under anesthestics and within 2 hours of waking up, was in no pain and racing through the house like nothing ever happened and when his case manager came over had run outside, climbed to the top of the van and jumped off before either of us could stop him...We're talking about a child who cannot sleep..Once he gets to sleep, cannot stay asleep for more than 3 hours because he is racing..His tantrums, when he is raging are so severe that he can scream at the top of his lungs for more than an hour straight..He can be (but usually isn't) violent and he is physically stronger than I am...He is not spoiled by any means...I set a rule and I do not back down under any circumstances, regardless of the screaming, kicking, throwing things, etc...And every single time there is a consequence that follows...I have 2 other perfectly "normal" children who do not have his problems and I am frequently complimented on how nice my kids are...The point here is, I am an advocate for my child...I do not like that he has to be on medication, but he has threatened suicide...At 8!!!!Years old..I do not take lightly that he needs medication..It took me over a year of therapy for him to decide to conced to trying medication and I have seen a completely different, relaxed and happy child whose self-esteem has increased..Please, until you know what I and others are really going through, reserve your judgments...You do more harm than good for those who are looking for help..

I really dont want to judge you or your actions, i'm not there and I dont know what it is like. At the same time this thread makes me want to cry, seriously, I dont cry often either. My niece and nephew are heavily medicated from a very young age, same types of meds, but you could throw another couple in there. In their case I can honestly say, because I was there; it was their parents lack of attention and lack of discipline. I find it absolutely disgusting that because my niece was having trouble reading, she was within months put on adderall (amphetamine), zoloft (antidepressants), valium (tranquilizers) and depakote. I know she doesnt have problems, its becausew my brother is on the road a lot and his wife works in daycare, meaning she doesnt have much evergy to "deal" with her own children when she gets home.

This is pretty much all I have to say, and again i'm not implying that this is your case, but my g-d it is troubling for me to think about. All those drugs will affect childerens growth development and make them drugs addicts before theyre even aware of what a drug is.

I'm sorry it just bothers me, I wish you the best of luck, just do what you
think is right.

~silver

Silver, not all cases are like your neice and nephew's. Many children .D.O need medications for their disorders to be treated. Granted, I don't have children of my own yet, but I grew up with a brother who had .A.D.H.D and it wasn't easy. Did that mean my mom "ignored" him and didn't raise him right? Absolutely not. My mother is a wonderful, loving, caring woman. All of my siblings and myself were raised to be good people, I think. My brother was diagnosed at a young age (probably 6) and was put on ritalin to control his adhd symptoms, and it did help. Later on, in his young to mid-teenage years, he was put on paxil. Now at the age of 20, my brother is a very well-rounded, smart, funny, wonderful individual. It had absolutely nothing to do with my parents' behaviors or actions. There really are such things as "chemical imbalances", no matter what tom cruise may think!!!

Now on to my fiance, who was recently diagnosed with bipolar disorder. Again, this is a chemical imbalance and had absolutely nothing to do with how he was raised. In this case, he was in a very bad motorcycle accident 4 years ago, which contributed to his being bipolar. After the accident, he went through rapid-cycle emotions; one minute he'd be laughing, the next he'd be in a fit of rage, and the next he'd be crying. He finally got on medication about 6 months ago, after being in denial for so many years. And I can honestly say that he has made a complete 180 turn. I don't have to worry about saying something that will put him into a rage, I don't have to worry about his happiness being very temporary and short-lived... Because I really never knew what type of mood he would be in. He is on depakote and celexa, and they have worked wonders.

I guess my point is.... Please think twice before you think that all cases are related to parenting behaviors.

Please think twice before assuming I said these mothers were doing that. Without actually reading what I said.

To quote myself;

"again i'm not implying that this is the case"

and i'm not like tom cruise, what he said made me lose a lot of respect for him, although he is in the scientology cult. I for one have gone through almost all the meds listed in this thread, including effexor, zoloft, wellbutrin, ativan, klonopin, xanax, valium, adderall, depakote, and was almost forced into lithium.........

The thread just reminded me of my family, and it made me sad, I for one have been diagnosed, bipolar, gad, and ocd, it's not a fun combination.