Okay, so I agree with current unbiased medical knowledge. I do believe that fetal pain is an issue at 20 weeks, but of course when fetal surgery is done the fetus gets anesthetics through the mother. Fetal pain for me is not an issue in the abortion debate, the womans pain and or needs are the issue for me. Women who do terminate at 20 weeks and beyond normally do so because of defects. If there are women here who have aborted past 20 weeks for non medical reasons, I do not mean to insult. But the majority of abortions done past 20 weeks are because of fetal deformity/disease, or the mothers health. Anyway, my whole point is that for amny pro choicers fetal pain does not matter, because the woman is naturally more important.

True indeed. During pregnancy a women will experience far more pain than the fetus ever will, but noone seems to care about the womans aches and pains.

the fact that you don't care about fetal pain shows that you have no respect for humanity. Period. End of story.

and I supposed that the fetus deserves to be slaughtered?

It is inside of the womans body, if she wants it "slaughtered", then yes it is her right. Fetal pain is only an issue if the child is wanted, and fetal surgery is performed.

i am woman and I think being pregnant is a miracle feeling, definetly not suffering. Too bad you don't see pregancy as something so incredibly wonderful like most people do. That is why we have 21 forum boards here for pregnancy. Tell me why do "you" think being pregnant is suffering? I can only imagine that you are a very young person who wants to live like adults too quickly. When one enjoys youth doing other things that are not sex when you become an adult you will see pregnancy as something wonderful.

how old you are?



I do expect people to think the same regarding the right to life and i'm sorry you don't feel this way. I hope you understand that somebody has to speak for this defendless unborn children.

i don't want to enslave them, I want them to be responsible citizens. There is got to be limits set up. Stealing is wrong right? If poor people steal they would have a better life but you can't accept stealing. Same goes for killing people.


If you don't want a child to happen then don't have sex.

It is being responsible, maybe not in a way that you agree with, but it is.. I do not agree with welfare, and women having numerous babies on medicaid ect... Because they are not paying for their own children, they are asking other people to pay for their kids. How is that responsible? Making others pay for babies that poor women have?

Having an abortion is being responsible, maybe you do not like it, but it's still responsible. How is it being a good citizen to have a baby when you are poor and cannot even afford your own food? Many women who have abortions do so because they are poor, and cannot have a child yet.

don't want a child? Don't get pregnant.

I am a teacher, and I see so many children on free and reduced lunch...that can't even afford to eat breakfast/dinner...and are scared to death that lunch may be their only meal. They are dirty, scared, and hopeless. The people on here that say "don't want a child, don't get pregnant" are ignorant. You need to step into the real world and experience things outside of your little bubble. It's real, it's relevant, and it's your future. Consider your words, put on someone elses shoes, and experience life outside of your box.

TEACHER112

Do you think the children in your care better off dead? That death would be better for them than life? Or you simply think they need better parents/homes and the people abusing them should be jailed? It's an either or question.

A rapist feels pain too but nobody is advocating that he has the right to use a woman's body against her will.

I don't care what you call it or how soon it's capable of feeling pain: fetuses shouldn't be granted more rights than born people. If a woman isn't willing to share her body even to preserve a life, she should have as much right as a man to deny it. Biology should never make slaves of half the population. If I can't force you to give me a drop of blood to live, you shouldn't be able to force me to incubate.

It's pretty bloody simple. Women are HUMAN BEINGS, not reproductive slaves. We're entitled to refuse the use of our bodily resources no matter who's asking for them.

The question you pose is irrelevant. These children are already born, sentient humans. And just because a child is hungry does not mean they are unloved. Perhaps their parents are in financial straits? Any abuse of a child should be reported to authorities and if you cannot afford to feed your child you should consider government programs that aid in that matter. But the sad reality is that MANY children are hungry in this world and not every country can provide government aid for their inhabitants. The other sad reality is that abortion is so looked down upon that women, no matter how many mouths they cannot AFFORD to feed, still don't consider it an option (or do not go through with it), whether out of fear or impact on their social stigma. I do not think any abortion is wrong. I think they are all done for reasons that one cannot even comprehend. I agree with Teacher112, it is time to step out of our bubbles and try to put ourselves in another's shoes.

I totally disagree, to claim having an abortion or not having one is responsible opens up a huge slipepry scope If having an abortion when poor responsible then is having one when wealthy irresponsible? WHy not? Is aborting because you simply want no child of yours to ever be born responsible? Yeah tough questions leave responsibility out of this, it has nothign to do with that and everything to do with what the pregnant woman wants. When it comes to having an abortion. But a fetus will NOT be considered a human being if someone forces an abortion on her because it isnt one if she chooses it herself.

Aborting when you know you cannot or will not provide for the child is responsible. It is not responsible to birth a child you will not or cannot take adequate care of.

Who are you to determine who can and can not care ofr a child and who made you queen of all uteruses? The point of being pro-choice is to respect EITHER choice, regardless under any and all circumstances because it isn't for you to decide and it isn't your body or your business.

The woman with 14 abortions is no more responsible or irresponsible than the woman who bore 14 children.

No one is claiming to make a decisio FOR anyone else. The point was that if a woman DECIDES she cannot look after a child, and/or that having another child or remaining pregnant will negatively affect her ability to look after any existing children, and she DECIDES to have an abortion because she BELIEVES it is the responsible thing to do, that is her CHOICE.

And yes, it is perfectly legitimate to look at someone who has had 14 abortions as more responsible than someone who has had 14 children they cannot look after, and keeps popping them out one after the other regardless. We are allowed to make any value judgements we like on other people on whatever subject, after all. The person making the decision doesn't have to agree with our judgements, but neither should they ask for our approval of their decisions.

No one is asking for approval, I've said that in my own posts before that approval should NOT be sought, your decisions should stand alone and be guarded by you because you are proud of or at the bare minimum feel you made the right choice.

HOWEVER unless you are asked to judge who are you to judge? Values? Those have NOTHING to do with reproductive rights because most people don't share the same set of morals and values to judge accurately based on those criteria.

I would say ANY woman bearing children unmarried or not in a happy marriage are WRONG because the fetuses they bear turn into children who need fathers who turn into adults who are most likely to go to prison (the hughest commonality amonsgt US inmates -federal or state- is FATHERLESSNESS. Statistically I am correct and accurate in my statements which could you cross referenced with the BOJ and the CDC. Its not nice, its tactless and its wrong to make that statement because it places MY values -however statistically accurate or correct into someone else's womb. I have NO place there, neither do you or motherofhighspiritedones.

I feel like this, dont go sticking yourself in a womb where you're not wanted, she has the right to abort you if you do and completely dismiss your antics and place you right up there with other anti-choicers. Either you respect the right to make a decision in any and all LEGAL circumstances or you don't and you're anti-choice.

I've said before that many of you come off pro-abortion and you prove it everytime you say more abortions is better and more responsible than more babies.