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Debate Forums > Abortion Debate Forum > Late Term/PBA (Page 1)
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Q: Late Term/PBA
asked by: manuftw82 on February 13th, 2008
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How do you feel about Late term and/or Partial birth abortions. (I'm only asking pro-choicers because I know that obviously pro-lifers are against it).
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Jude-Love
replied on February 13th, 2008
Active User, very eHealthy
I feel that women should be able to abort electively up until the point of viability. After that, I think a health reason is acceptable.
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Reptar
replied on February 13th, 2008
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I disagree with late term/partial birth abortions unless there is a health reason. I think most pro-choice people will agree. The closer you get to birth, the more is seems you can justify killing a born child.
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Jincks013
replied on February 13th, 2008
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I , personally, would not abort late term as an elective procedure unless my fetus had a severe chromosonal abnormality or defect which would either be non viable after birth or have a poor quality of life, I will still support this option for another woman to chose though.
The so called (because it is NOT a legitimate medical term) partial-birth abortion is often the safest method of late term abortion procedures for just those circumstances.
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oopoopoop
replied on February 13th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
Around 90% of abortions are performed in the first trimester. The vast majority of abortions performed after the first trimester are for serious medical reasons (although many second trimester are due to delays or difficulty in accessing abortion for those who would dearly have liked to do it earlier), including abnormality or danger to the mother's health/life, so I have no problem with late term abortions whatever. There is no such thing as "partial birth abortion.".

My view is that if the fetus is "viable" , then go ahead and induce delivery or perform a caesarean. Whoever has the means can then deal with keeping it alive and dealing with the result disabilities. The vast majority of the fetuses aborted at this stage would not be viable in any case (eg anencephaly, etc.).
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Birch
replied on February 13th, 2008
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I do not draw a line in the sand for any other woman making her own personal medical decisions, just myself.
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manuftw82
replied on February 13th, 2008
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poopoopoo wrote:
Around 90% of abortions are performed in the first trimester. The vast majority of abortions performed after the first trimester are for serious medical reasons (although many second trimester are due to delays or difficulty in accessing abortion for those who would dearly have liked to do it earlier), including abnormality or danger to the mother's health/life, so I have no problem with late term abortions whatever. There is no such thing as "partial birth abortion.".

My view is that if the fetus is "viable" , then go ahead and induce delivery or perform a caesarean. Whoever has the means can then deal with keeping it alive and dealing with the result disabilities. The vast majority of the fetuses aborted at this stage would not be viable in any case (eg anencephaly, etc.).

...Partial birtch abortion meaning the technique they use...
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Birch
replied on February 13th, 2008
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That's not a medical term, or a technique at all. It was coined by a prolife politician.

"The term "partial-birth abortion" is primarily used in political discourse — chiefly regarding the legality of abortion in the United States.[19] The term is not recognized as a medical term by the American Medical Association[20] nor the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists.[21] This term was first suggested in 1995 by pro-life congressman Charles T. Canady, while developing the original proposed Partial-Birth Abortion Ban." -wikipedia
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manuftw82
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Birch wrote:
That's not a medical term, or a technique at all. It was coined by a prolife politician.

"The term "partial-birth abortion" is primarily used in political discourse — chiefly regarding the legality of abortion in the United States.[19] The term is not recognized as a medical term by the American Medical Association[20] nor the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists.[21] This term was first suggested in 1995 by pro-life congressman Charles T. Canady, while developing the original proposed Partial-Birth Abortion Ban." -wikipedia

Either way did you not know what I was talking about?
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Birch
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Doesn't even matter. There's more to this forum than just you and I. There are lurkers everywhere.

It's important to debunk myths, be factually true. There is no medical term or technique named 'partial birth abortion'.
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manuftw82
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Birch wrote:
Doesn't even matter. There's more to this forum than just you and I. There are lurkers everywhere.

It's important to debunk myths, be factually true. There is no medical term or technique named 'partial birth abortion'.

What should I call it then? I did make an honest mistake. Because that's the only term I've ever heard used. So please correct me.
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Birch
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Just so you know, I didn't mean anything I said to come off as catty or anything. Sometimes people think I am. (Sometimes they're right, but not this time. Very Happy)

It's called an intact D&E, or intact D&X, short for dilation and extraction. It's not pleasant, if you want to read about it you can google it on various sites.
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manuftw82
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Birch wrote:
Just so you know, I didn't mean anything I said to come off as catty or anything. Sometimes people think I am. (Sometimes they're right, but not this time. Very Happy)

It's called an intact D&E, or intact D&X, short for dilation and extraction. It's not pleasant, if you want to read about it you can google it on various sites.

It's okay I know you meant no harm Smile . And actually I think I read something about a D&E so I guess that's what they meant.
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Tylanas
replied on February 13th, 2008
Especially eHealthy
Re: Question for Pro-choicers
manuftw82 wrote:
How do you feel about Late term and/or Partial birth abortions. (I'm only asking pro-choicers because I know that obviously pro-lifers are against it).


I personally am against voluntary late-term abortions, no matter how they are performed. I feel that any abortion done after week 27 constitutes as a late-term abortion.

Why do I feel this way?
1. Abortion verges on unnecessarily dangerous for the mother at this time.
2. The fetus is viable.

As for partial birth abortions (or d&e's) on their own, to my knowledge they are rare to nearly non existent and are only done in late-term cases anyway. I don't actually have anything against them, either. It doesn't seem any more barbaric to me than a normal suction or curettage abortion.

Of course in cases to save the mother's life and extenuating circumstances - and yes it has to be a case-by-case issue - late-term abortions are fine.
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sistersister
replied on February 14th, 2008
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Abortion after 22 weeks must meet specific criteria. It is not elective. In Kansas there must either be a anomaly in the fetus or a threat to the womans physical or mental health. a second Doctor must concur that the patient meets the criteria.

In the case of our clinic there is most time a third doctor (the one who refered the patient to our services to begin with, then us then the second doctor)

Contrary to what operation would like to say yu cannot just show up say your a little blue and get a late term abortion. We turn patients away every week that do not meet the criteria.

We are one of the very few clinics tha tdo late terms. As has already been said pba was a political ploy and does not exist.

There are procedures that collaspe the dead fetus head and they are used when the fetus has deformities that make the head to large to safely pass through the birth canal and very rarely done.

the pba ban has not prevented one abortion becuase it banned a nonexistant procedure. It was writen so vaguely in the hope that it could then be interrupted to make almost all abortions illegal under a consevative dominated court (with the turn in this election and the greater possibility it will be a Democrat appoints the next few judges that will not happen) It was a back door political ploy to make abortion illegal. they know they cannot get a outright ban on abortion.

At our clinic we do labor and delivery abortions. It is a four day procedure. The fetus is intact. Most of our patients have very much wanted pregnancies that have gone wrong for either the fetus or the woman. the patients are given the chance to spend time with the fetus after delivery along with family if they choose.

Eiri made a very good point, the latter in the pregnancy the more complicated the procedure. It is safest if you are going to abort to do so as early as possible. Of course many defects do not show up until after the first trimester.
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bbfeet9
replied on February 14th, 2008
Experienced User
Almost 5 months.........
My daughter is a drug addict. She found out she was pregnant early on. Giving her adequate time to make a decision. She farted around and around until we were at the 4 month stage. She felt life, she had a little belly, she was sick, all the things that go on with the first few months of life.

She had an abortion. I took her to the hospital in two stages. The first trip was a prep. Blood work, paperwork, and synthetic dialation. The second day, well, it was horrible. It didn't take long, about an hour. I can't (or don't) want to go in to the details, but i wouldn't ever want to sit through something like that again. I still see her face in my mind when i walked into that recovery room. So, so painful and emotional. You can read about my daughter on the addiction and drug thread. Entitled...I am losing my child to drugs. God Bless
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Darkmoon
replied on February 14th, 2008
Active User, very eHealthy
I'm fine with them because with the exception of rare (and most often illegal) cases they are only performed because of complications that put the mother at risk or result in deformity. I don't believe women should be legally compelled to gestate a fetus if they develop cancer and can't get treatment for it while pregnant. That should be their choice.

Prolife lies and propaganda would have us believe that women abort late term for frivolous reasons, which is a misogynistic character assassination of all females. No sane woman would put her body through all that just to decide at the last minute to abort, and even if there were a woman alive that would conduct such a useless endeavor the law would not permit it without extenuating circumstances.
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Jincks013
replied on February 15th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
There are many lethal chromosonal abnormalities which are not detectable until the 2nd or 3rd trimester. A woman then has a choice to either gestate it, knowing that her fetus will die during or immediately after the birth or ELECT to have a late term abortion. THis is where the pro-fetal-liars are deliberately misconstruing the evidence.
Elective abortion isn't "oh I'm six months pregnant and don't want a baby now" in most cases. Its because the woman elected not to continue a pregnancy that will not survive and is not viable outside the uterus.
Once again I urge people to look at the real Evidence before jumping to conclusions.
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yodavater
replied on February 15th, 2008
Active User, very eHealthy
sistersister wrote:
Abortion after 22 weeks must meet specific criteria. It is not elective. In Kansas there must either be a anomaly in the fetus or a threat to the womans physical or mental health. a second Doctor must concur that the patient meets the criteria..

"At Women's Health Care Services, we specialize in "late" abortion care. We are able to perform elective abortions to the time in the pregnancy when the fetus is viable. Viability is not a set point in time. Viability is determined by the attending physician and is based on sonogram results, physical examination and last menstrual period date (if known)."
http://www.drtiller.com/elect.html

AND..... the person making the "viability" call is the person (abortionist) who stands to earn thousands of dollars from the abortion.
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Tylanas
replied on February 15th, 2008
Especially eHealthy
I see nothing wrong with the above statement since viability will almost always be confirmed past about 22-27 weeks. The only part of your above statement that is stupid is the comment about money. Please. Doctors could make a lot more money if they mistreated their patients. But they don't. I personally have never been mistreated by a doctor, and I've never known someone who was purposely mistreated in a way that made them pay more.
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