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Debate Forums > Abortion Debate Forum > I have changed my mind, sort of. (Page 1)
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Q: I have changed my mind, sort of.
asked by: manuftw82 on February 12th, 2008
Supporter
I am still pro-life for myself and I am still pro-life for others but I no longer agree with legislating against abortion. I just went into the medical abortions forum and read through a lot of different accounts of people's abortion and I was imagining if abortion had not been legal these women (most of them maybe) would have gotten one done illegally and all the pain they went through could have been worse and likely a hell of a lot more dangerous. If it must be done I'd rather it be done safe then in some back alley.
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killbill
replied on February 12th, 2008
Experienced User
That's very compassionate.
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Tylanas
replied on February 12th, 2008
Especially eHealthy
Thank you Smile That's the reason abortion became legal in the first place: to save lives. That's a very pro-life stance, if you think about it!
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Birch
replied on February 12th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
That is marvelously beautiful! Thank you for sharing this with us!!!
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Jincks013
replied on February 12th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
Someday we may find the perfect answer to the abortion question. Some day when sexual education is filled with fact, when birth control is given out freely, when we have, as a society, grown up enough to realize problems do not go away because we legislate them; then abortion will not be as wide spread because people will be smarter and have the appropriate tools to use to stop unwanted pregnancies from occuring.
I think you are very brave for posting a change of view !!
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Verizon-y
replied on February 13th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.
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yodavater
replied on February 13th, 2008
Active User, very eHealthy
Re: I have changed my mind, sort of.
manuftw82 wrote:
I am still pro-life for myself and I am still pro-life for others but I no longer agree with legislating against abortion.

Then you are, by definition, prochoice/proabortion.

manuftw82 wrote:

I just went into the medical abortions forum and read through a lot of different accounts of people's abortion and I was imagining if abortion had not been legal these women (most of them maybe) would have gotten one done illegally and all the pain they went through could have been worse and likely a hell of a lot more dangerous. .

First, prolifers do not do abortions, either legal or illegal. Only prochoicers do them. Second, you seem to be saying that the safety of the perpetrator of mortal violence ought to be of more importance than stopping the killing itself.
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Jincks013
replied on February 13th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
So you support women being killed or permanently maimed by pregnancy then Yoda? is that Pro-Life or is it Pro-mysogyny?
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Reptar
replied on February 13th, 2008
Experienced User
No, she realizes that legislating against abortion will only cause more deaths. If a woman wants an abortion, she will get one. You'd think someone who is pro-life would rather only one person die instead of two. Or does a women loose status as person because she makes the "horrible" decision to have an abortion?
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manuftw82
replied on February 13th, 2008
Supporter
Reptar wrote:
No, she realizes that legislating against abortion will only cause more deaths. If a woman wants an abortion, she will get one. You'd think someone who is pro-life would rather only one person die instead of two. Or does a women loose status as person because she makes the "horrible" decision to have an abortion?

That's what I mean. I would still rather no one get abortions but it's obviously going to happen so I'd rather it be done safe then have some scared woman dying at the hands of an unlicensed, illegal practitioner. Hopefully in the future they will find some super 100% effective form of birth control and abortions won't be needed. Then I think everyone wins. But until then this is pretty much the lesser of two evils. And this doesn't make me pro-choice (although I plan to do more research on both sides).
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Birch
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Speaking of super effective birth control, how about this Paraguard IUD that's out now?
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manuftw82
replied on February 13th, 2008
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Birch wrote:
Speaking of super effective birth control, how about this Paraguard IUD that's out now?

ahh I've never heard of it! I'll go look it up
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Verizon-y
replied on February 14th, 2008
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manuftw82 wrote:
Reptar wrote:
No, she realizes that legislating against abortion will only cause more deaths. If a woman wants an abortion, she will get one. You'd think someone who is pro-life would rather only one person die instead of two. Or does a women loose status as person because she makes the "horrible" decision to have an abortion?

That's what I mean. I would still rather no one get abortions but it's obviously going to happen so I'd rather it be done safe then have some scared woman dying at the hands of an unlicensed, illegal practitioner. Hopefully in the future they will find some super 100% effective form of birth control and abortions won't be needed. Then I think everyone wins. But until then this is pretty much the lesser of two evils. And this doesn't make me pro-choice (although I plan to do more research on both sides).


I think what she means by:

"And this doesn't make me pro-choice"

is, and correct me if I'm wrong, but, there really is no "name" like pro-life, or pro-choice, that fits with the reality she's discovered. For example, there really is no such thing as "pro-life" as in wanting to stop abortion by making it illegal, because making abortion illegal will not stop abortion. So she can't be pro-life if it means stopping abortion by making it illegal, since there is no such thing.

She's not pro-life as in just wanting to make abortion illegal, yet realizing women will abort anyway, because she realizes women will die in this case.

She's not pro-choice because she doesn't want anyone to choose abortion.

JMHO. Smile
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manuftw82
replied on February 14th, 2008
Supporter
futureshock hit the nail on the head. I guess maybe you could call me pro-choice but strongly hoping anyone won't choose abortion?
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Tylanas
replied on February 14th, 2008
Especially eHealthy
manuftw82 wrote:
futureshock hit the nail on the head. I guess maybe you could call me pro-choice but strongly hoping anyone won't choose abortion?

That's a perfectly acceptable way to feel. I mean personally I wouldn't call myself "pro-abortion" but there are cases where I do feel it is the best choice. I also wouldn't call myself pro-life but there are cases where I believe abortion is absolutely wrong.
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Tylanas
replied on February 14th, 2008
Especially eHealthy
manuftw82 wrote:
Birch wrote:
Speaking of super effective birth control, how about this Paraguard IUD that's out now?

ahh I've never heard of it! I'll go look it up

I've heard about Paraguard for years, it's not new is it?
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Jincks013
replied on February 14th, 2008
Extremely eHealthy
manuftw82 wrote:
futureshock hit the nail on the head. I guess maybe you could call me pro-choice but strongly hoping anyone won't choose abortion?


You are like my friend Nadeen; she is pro-choice for other women and pro life for herself and wants every woman to have informed consent; for either choice !!
complete information include psychological aspects of abortion;
Complete information about birth, risks, post partum depression and time rescheduling.
Complete information on relingquishing including post partum depression and guilt.

There is a great deal more to the game here then meets the eye.
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yodavater
replied on February 15th, 2008
Active User, very eHealthy
futureshock wrote:


is, and correct me if I'm wrong, but, there really is no "name" like pro-life, or pro-choice, that fits with the reality she's discovered.

You're wrong.

Pro-choice means that you support the legal status of elective abortion, which the poster clearly does.

pro-choice adjective advocating access to legal abortion: advocating open legal access to voluntary abortion http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_/pro-cho ice.html
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Tylanas
replied on February 15th, 2008
Especially eHealthy
Yoda is an extremist who doesn't believe that these terms can be fuzzy. Of course I'd expect such black and white thinking from an extremist.
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manuftw82
replied on February 15th, 2008
Supporter
Eiri wrote:
Yoda is an extremist who doesn't believe that these terms can be fuzzy. Of course I'd expect such black and white thinking from an extremist.

You're right, not everything is black and white and I think black and white thinking is why most people argue. I kind of agree with both sides.
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