Even If I Am Going to Hell....

YOU ARE AWESOME!!!!!! I know exactly what you mean. Some days I believe and some days I don't and it isn't anybodies business if I do or not. Those bible thumping right wing zealots don't want this gay man in there heaven anyway so what is it to them if I have a Human Rights Foundation bumper sticker and a rain bow flag on my car? You keep on keeping on, girlfriend!
Peace and Love,
Steve;)

I wouldn't even want to be around this jackwipe of a god who had this dude about to kill his son and all that other tomfoolery. He sounds like the devil to me.

But my cousin whom I love and adore is a christian, and actually was a youth group director at a church until recently. The thing is, she doesn't condemn me or fret about my eternal soul. I would say that most religious individuals don't much think about the salvation of strangers. But there are a few out there who insist on telling me what they think of me. I just wanted to know if anyone could give me an idea as to why that is.

I don't want to turn this thread into a thread about how awful Christians are, because I think the majority of christians are good people, just like I think the majority of people are good people.

Could we talk about how awful the religion is? *bats eyes innocently*

Eh, nevermind. That's ever other thread.

Maybe people do it for the same reason I get vocal with adults hitting children-they think it's a good thing to speak up and just can't help themselves if they see this obvious transgression.

i'm a christian, or at least, i think of myself as one, and i think you are a great person. i wouldn't say i'm unconcerned about the fate of your eternal soul, but, it's not for me to say what that fate will be. i believe in a loving god who transcends these worldly and trivial divisions we humans create amongst ourselves. god is love and if you live your life with love in your heart then god lives there too and if god has something to say to you all you have to do is listen to your heart. people mean well, but, like i said before, some put beliefs before spirit. i think, if i can look at a person and recognize someone who has a strong spirit and a good heart, then i don't have to worry about them.

You know, I think Jesus is really cool but some of his followers give me the creeps! GOD is great but Religion separates and alienates and splinters people into judgmental little cubbyholes.

well i go to church every sunday and participate in a lot of church activities and consider myself part of the church so how do you think what you just said makes me feel? judged maybe? alienated? it's cool though. just that i know a lot of religious people who are exactly the opposite of what you just said.

I'm sorry. You are wright.
So how do you feel about homosexuals? How about Muslims? The Jewish? The Atheist? You don't think any of them are doomed to eternal Hell? Truly, the truth..please. I go to church also so I am just curious. I believe in God without doubt. And I believe in a GOD without walls.

i asked a priest once, a friend of mine, about my ancestors because they are native and were not christians. he told me to read these scriptures:

"Everyone that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God."

"No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us.”

"whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him"

"'Come, you who are blessed by God take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'

"Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?'

"Christ will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these, you did for me.'

There's a saying...I can't recall where I've heard it but it goes:

"Jesus, save me from your followers!"

Most non-Christians are more contemptuous of the followers than they are the religion itself. After all, guns don't fire themselves and cars don't run people over without a driver behind the wheel. The actions of the followers is what has earned such contempt from others. The two most hated religions in the world are also the two most popular; Christianity and Islam. The larger the community, the more likely it will be to have outspoken, badly behaved or crazed members.

Look at online gaming, for an example. World of Warcraft has the most obnoxious player community on record compared to other games of its genre, but it also has the largest population. It isn't that World of Warcraft specifically promotes that kind of behavior-it's just that it has a larger following than games like Vanguard or Everquest II right now, and thus to a player of the latter mentioned games the population of World of Warcraft seems to have an inordinate amount of bungholes.

So the impression that a non-Christian or non-Muslim person gets when witnessing the verbal harassment, terrorism, funeral crashers, arrogant elitists, prejudice, sexism and violence committed so often by those associated with these big name religions is that Christian and Muslim faiths attract these kinds of people. It can be difficult to keep the peaceful ones in a different category from the loud ones, because the peaceful ones tend to leave people alone and thus aren't as noticeable.

It's like George Carlin said: "Ever heard someone say, 'Its the quiet ones you gotta watch?" If you walk in a bar and one guy is sitting there minding his own business reading a book, but the other guy is screaming 'I'M GONNA KILL THE NEXT SON-OF-A-B**CH THAT WALKS IN HERE'.................Who ya gonna watch??? Because I'll bet you while you're watching the 'quiet one', the 'noisy one' will effing KILL YOU!" (not an exact quote due to forum censorship and an imperfect memory )

Everyday I read in the news about people committing crimes and it's always people that don't go to church, people that are not christians at all. So if i were to ask God to save me from his followers I also have to ask him to save me from not his followers.

If you don't live a life of love then you are not christian even if you "label" yourself as one.

What about if you live a life of love and you are a buddhist? (Many Buddhists practice ahimsa which translates literally into "do no harm", so my guess is they aren't the ones out theere committing crimes) I think the people who commit crimes do so for one of two main reasons. 1. they are or have been cut off from family, friends and have no positive social network or 2. They do so out of desperation and lack of positive modeling.

When I think of the idea of heaven there is one major flaw for me. Eternal happiness and eternal relief. All the good things heaven is suppose to be cannot co-exist with the existence of hell (in my mind). I am not able to believe I can be happy and free in heaven, while others are suffering eternally. People I loved, friends, family, even just kind strangers.

This thought nagged at me when I was really trying to get myself to believe in God. I couldn't be happy while others suffered. How could anyone be happy knowing some of those they cared about are in a place of constant agony? I couldn't prescribe to a religion where God handed out eternal consequences, a religion that seemed to be based around punishment and damnation.

That is just a little thought I have as to why some Christians are so concerned for the souls of other. Some people are just genuinely concerned for the happiness and wellness of others.

but that was the question i asked, basically. "what about people of different religions?" and that was the answer i was given. no one knows for sure where any of us are going anyway. why not concentrate on making a better world right now and leave the afterlife to god? my baby is being baptised soon and one of the vows we take on her behalf until she can make the choice for herself is to strive for justice and peace among all people, and respect the dignity of every human being and to seek and serve Christ in all persons, loving your neighbour as yourself. i was speaking with my priest and she said that the church (our church, anyway) has moved more toward those promises being the identity of the church and that is a good thing because it widens the circle of love and acceptance. so, if a buddhist lives a life of love, serving others and striving for peace and justice, then they are living the word of god. they may not be a Christian, but they are living Christ's word, and he said so many times that that is the important thing, not the legalities or the rituals.

Where I live, the news doesn't report if someone who committed a crime followed a church or not, unless it's another priest/sexual abuse case or an archbishop denying it.

Then there are cases where religion is public knowledge but not mentioned in the news like the good Christian leaders of this Christian country committing acts of torture, deceit, etc.
http://media.www.independ entcollegian.com/media/storage/paper678/ne ws/2006/10/26/News/Cheney.Admits.Torture-2 403380.shtml

http://en.wikipedia.o rg/wiki/Waterboarding

And then the crimes against humanity committed by public figures of religion, such as the Pope, for his declarations against homosexuals.

If people would just care about one another. Religion for the powerless is fine. Religion for the powerful corrupts.

Darkmoon and Marvel are both saying what I couldn't find the words to say. I appreciate it. Judge not,people...I don't want you judging me and I will do my best not to judge you but please let me have my freedom to not choose your God and give me the right to say so without retribution of Hell or being tied to the cross...or dragged behind a pick up or tied to a fence like a scarecrow. A zealot is a zealot.