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sistersister
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 27 Sep 2007
Posts: 145
Location: ,
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Posted: 12-27-07 10:57am
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Birch
Supporter
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 4153
Location: Bliss,
Thanks: 159
Thanked:16
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Posted: 12-27-07 12:32pm
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| yodavater
wrote: | | Syrenity
wrote: |
If I had become pregnant after my attack,
I know that I would have as soon cut it
out of my belly myself rather than let it
squirm & grow
there. |
"Squirm"? Does "squirming" have some sort
of negative connotation to
you? |
"Rape"? Does "rape" have some sort of
negative connotation to you?
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yodavater
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 818
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Posted: 12-28-07 10:56am
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| Jincks013
wrote: |
Think tadpole or snake here
yoda. |
Why? Do you not understand that we are
100% human at all times?
| Jincks013
wrote: |
Again.. how do you intend to reduce the
need for abortions?
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First, by making it illegal. When it is
no longer "just like pulling a tooth", as
some people claim, fewer people will see
it as something they "need". After that,
by supporting more government and private
assistance to women with crisis
pregnancies.
| Jincks013
wrote: |
How do you intend to preserve the life and
sanity of a sexual assault victim who is
impregnated? What about fetii with
malformations that will not permit
survival outside the uterus? such as a
fetus with exencephaly (thats the brain
being outside the cranial vault) and the
mother isn't told or its not obvious until
her 3rd trimester..
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Sanity is best preserved by trained
professionals in the field of mental
health, not by a procedure which kills a
baby.
Health related abortion/early delivery is
a whole different field. All I'm talking
about is healthy mothers who electively
kill their healthy babies.
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yodavater
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 818
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Posted: 12-28-07 10:57am
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| Birch
wrote: |
"Rape"? Does "rape" have some sort of
negative connotation to
you? |
Yes, it does.
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Moo
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 1066
Location: London
Thanks: 21
Thanked:111
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Posted: 12-28-07 11:05am
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| yodavater
wrote: |
| Jincks013
wrote: |
Again.. how do you intend to reduce the
need for abortions?
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First, by making it illegal.
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How will that reduce the need for
abortion?
| yodavater
wrote: | | When it is no longer "just
like pulling a tooth", as some people
claim, fewer people will see it as
something they "need". After that, by
supporting more government and private
assistance to women with crisis
pregnancies. |
If you honestly think that is how abortion
is viewed then you're so out of touch,
that isn't why women feel they "need" an
abortion (I know having been one of those
women) and all the assistance the
government can throw at you will not
change the fact that some women do not
want to be pregnant.
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yodavater
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 818
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Posted: 12-28-07 11:33am
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| Moo
wrote: | | all the assistance the
government can throw at you will not
change the fact that some women do not
want to be
pregnant. |
I know. That's why it needs to be
illegal.
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Moo
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 1066
Location: London
Thanks: 21
Thanked:111
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Posted: 12-28-07 11:38am
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| yodavater
wrote: | | Moo
wrote: | | all the assistance the
government can throw at you will not
change the fact that some women do not
want to be
pregnant. |
I know. That's why it needs to be
illegal. |
That wont prevent abortion though, can you
not see that? Or is your 'quest to save'
z/e/f's blinded you to any other factors
involved in abortion?
I'm so pleased I live in a country where I
can access safe and legal abortion,
although that wouldn't have prevent me
attempting to abort (and I do respect the
law, working in that field but abortion is
something that needs to remain legal for
the sake of women everywhere)
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yodavater
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 818
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Posted: 12-28-07 11:47am
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| Moo
wrote: |
That wont prevent abortion though, can you
not see that?
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I believe it will reduce it dramatically.
Just as laws against homicide keep this
from becoming an anarchistic society, but
do not "prevent" homicide, technically.
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Moo
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 1066
Location: London
Thanks: 21
Thanked:111
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Posted: 12-28-07 11:54am
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| yodavater
wrote: | | Moo
wrote: |
That wont prevent abortion though, can you
not see that?
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I believe it will reduce it dramatically.
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Well that's your choice to believe so
(it's difficult to find accurate numbers
of abortions performed before the 1967 act
so whilst the numbers have increased it's
difficult to find an accurate comparison,
not to mention the shift in society since
the last time abortions were illegally
performed here).
Laws shouldn't be enacted to please the
minority or to 'appear' to be doing the
'moral' thing and if women were placed in
a position again of seeking unsafe
abortions then this clearly would be the
case for such a law.
I think it's far more productive, however,
for those (both pl and pc) who realise
that re-criminalising abortion isn't the
way to tackle reducing the numbers. Better
sex ed/birth control etc are the way to
reduce abortion, not by imposing sanctions
on those who seek or those who provide
abortions.
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msrosie
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 369
Location: Ontario, Canada
Thanks: 12
Thanked:2
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Posted: 12-28-07 15:14pm
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| Moo
wrote: | .
That wont prevent abortion though, can you
not see that? Or is your 'quest to save'
z/e/f's blinded you to any other factors
involved in
abortion? |
Exactly. There's a study posted right on
this board that shows that abortion is
just as prevalent where illegal as where
legal.
| Quote: | | I'm so pleased I
live in a country where I can access safe
and legal abortion, although that wouldn't
have prevent me attempting to abort (and I
do respect the law, working in that field
but abortion is something that needs to
remain legal for the sake of women
everywhere) |
Amen to that, Birch. Fortunately, abortion
will not be illegal again in my country -
at least in the foreseeable future, but if
it were, I'd still abort if I were to
conceive. If I couldn't find a way to
abort, I'd kill myself. That is how bad I
do not EVER wish to be pregnant or give
birth.
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sociable_recluse
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 88
Location: , UK
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Posted: 12-28-07 19:55pm
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[quote="msrosie"] | Moo
wrote: | .
Amen to that, Birch. Fortunately, abortion
will not be illegal again in my country -
at least in the foreseeable future, but if
it were, I'd still abort if I were to
conceive. If I couldn't find a way to
abort, I'd kill myself. That is how bad I
do not EVER wish to be pregnant or give
birth. |
Same here msrosie, i'd do anything to
induce an abortion. Yes i want more
children in the future (i've already got a
5 year old son) but breeding will not be
for me again; i've decided to go for
adoption.
As an aside my sister emigrated from the
UK to Ontario 6 years ago.
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msrosie
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 369
Location: Ontario, Canada
Thanks: 12
Thanked:2
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Posted: 12-28-07 20:10pm
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| sociable_recluse
wrote: |
As an aside my sister emigrated from the
UK to Ontario 6 years
ago. |
What part of Ontario? I'm in the
southeastern part.
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sociable_recluse
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 88
Location: , UK
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Posted: 12-28-07 20:21pm
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| msrosie
wrote: | | sociable_recluse
wrote: |
As an aside my sister emigrated from the
UK to Ontario 6 years
ago. |
What part of Ontario? I'm in the
southeastern
part. |
Ottawa.
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Jincks013
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
Thanks: 23
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Posted: 12-28-07 22:42pm
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And making abortion illegal will stop it
right Yoda? Like we had Roe vs Wade
because abortion was illegal so it wasn't
done right? Like teh valid, factual,
timely and accurate report I posted
disproves this theory right yoda?
Obviously making it illegal does not and
will not stop abortions. Any other
disproven theories?
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msrosie
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 369
Location: Ontario, Canada
Thanks: 12
Thanked:2
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Posted: 12-29-07 15:18pm
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| sociable_recluse
wrote: | | msrosie
wrote: | | sociable_recluse
wrote: |
As an aside my sister emigrated from the
UK to Ontario 6 years
ago. |
What part of Ontario? I'm in the
southeastern
part. |
Ottawa. |
Oh, small world! I'm about an hour and a
half southwest of there, near Kingston.
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Snug
Experienced User , Rather EHEALTHy
Joined: 12 Dec 2007
Posts: 151
Location: In the jacuzzi, silly.
Thanks: 21
Thanked:0
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Posted: 12-31-07 07:42am
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| Jincks013
wrote: | And making abortion illegal
will stop it right Yoda? Like we had Roe
vs Wade because abortion was illegal so it
wasn't done right? Like teh valid,
factual, timely and accurate report I
posted disproves this theory right yoda?
Obviously making it illegal does not and
will not stop abortions. Any other
disproven
theories? |
At this point the anti-abortion folks are
pretty much hard-wired to come back with
"Well then let's legalize rape and
homicide too because making them illegal
hasn't stopped them from happening."
What they willfully fail to realize is
that there is a world of difference
between raping or murdering someone, and
choosing to not continue gestating. There
are no other circumstances where we
require a person to put themselves at risk
for another. Why should abortion be an
exception to that ancient legal, moral,
and social doctrine?
Even in places where abortion is illegal,
it is not considered homicide. Hell, in
Saudi Arabia they'll put you to death for
having an abortion, not because you killed
an embryo/fetus, but because you deprived
the father of his offspring. If even
THOSE tribalist, primitive, misogynist
froot loops don't place abortion in the
same category as homicide, well, ya gotta
know you're on to something when you say
it just isn't the same.
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yodavater
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 818
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Posted: 12-31-07 14:32pm
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| Jincks013
wrote: | | And making abortion illegal
will stop it right
Yoda? |
I've already answered that question. I
will add, though, that abortions are
performed by prochoicers, not by
prolifers. So in essence many prochoicers
are arguing that if abortion becomes
illegal again, they will simply kill more
women.
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Jincks013
Extremely EHEALTHy
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 1180
Location: ,
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Posted: 01-01-08 07:40am
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You haven't answered anything yet and
frankly as much obfuscation as you indulge
in I am fairly positive you do not have a
answer. Can we stop the little
diversionary tactics and just answer the
question.
"And making it illegal will stop it
right?" (Remember there is ample factual
current evidence to disprove this)
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yodavater
Active User, Really EHEALTHy
Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 818
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Posted: 01-01-08 16:13pm
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| Jincks013
wrote: |
"And making it illegal will stop it
right?" (Remember there is ample factual
current evidence to disprove
this) |
ONCE MORE.... for those of "short
memories"....... NO LAWS will completely
stop anything, including homicide, rape,
kidnapping robbery, and a lot of other
criminal acts... but such laws DO reduce
the total number of such acts. The same
would be true of laws against abortion,
IMO.
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sillyakchick
Supporter
Joined: 12 Apr 2007
Posts: 2712
Thanks: 8
Thanked:1
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Posted: 01-01-08 18:23pm
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But historically, it has not been so. Nor
is it so in other countries. And current
studies suggest that this remains true
still.
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