The Great Grim Reaper - Friend or Foe? (Page 1)

I think the outrage over "mercy killings" is that it often entails a caretaker or someone who would bear the burden of another's life taking that life while that person is in a state so fragile that they cannot speak on behalf of themselves. Of anything ever given to you, your life is the one thing that shouldn't be taken away for you in the name of mercy unless you specifically ask for that mercy. It especially shouldn't be taken from you by someone in the name of compassion because of what *they* want without regard to what you want.

Abortion isn't about mercy, its about the woman's right to remain pregnant for as long as nature allows or abort when she no longer wants to be pregnant or no longer wants that pregnancy.

Taking someone off life support who never expressed a desire to be taken off is about what their loved ones would want if they were in that position and what they can't bear to do; see their loved one incapicitated. Other times the reasons behind mercy killing has nothing to do with mercy or anything altruistic at all.

I TOTALLY agree with your last statement which is why I'm against the forcible sterilization of pets. If a pet had to decide to live with a human or live with its body in tact and not mutilated in the name of convenience, they'd probably choose not to allow it.

you have a good point although it sounds a little disturbing. i believe in reincarnation so abortion is no issue with me. You can't miss the life you never had right? Then you could just move onto the next life waiting in line for you. As for euthanasia. I have no problem with that at all. Death itself i believe to be a neutral process. It is neither good or bad, it is only seen as bad by the already living that witness the death of others.

But if you "die" yourself do you think you would cry? Do you think you would even care? Probably not. LIFE is difficult. LIFE is the hardest thing to bear. Death is peaceful and painless. The JOURNEY to death however is something entirely different.

Meh, I am not against forcible sterilization of pets. I am, however, against docking/cropping of animals, unless there is deformity involved (broken, dead/dying tail, ears damaged by fights, things like that) I am a responsible pet owner and breeder (Great Danes and Siamese cats). I believe that if your animal does not conform to certain aspects of a breed standard, that animal should be spayed/neutered. I also believe it is irresponsible to breed your animal for the sole purpose of getting a fat paycheck (think puppy mills). I breed animals that actually MEET or EXCEED their breed standards. Any reputable breeder will tell you that it is not about the money, it is about the breed standards, and any offspring that do not meet the standards for their breed is usually sold at a lower price and given limited registration. Which means they get spayed/neutered. Most of my animals are sold on limited registration, not because they are not show quality or do not conform to breed standards, but because of irresponsible pet owners. I do my best to insure that my animals go to safe homes, but you never know. Limited registration allows for some control, at least over breeding. I will, however, sell my animals to reputable persons on full registration. I also limit when my animals may breed (once every two years for the Danes, once a year for the cats, provided they are healthy enough or still young enough to not have complications) and how many litters they may have during their lifetime (three for my Great Danes, they are BIG dogs, thus strain of pregnancy can cause more hip problems later on for them, 4 for my Siamese cats, provided they are healthy enough, breeding age ceases at 6 years of age for both dogs and cats).

But enough on pets. I am on board with life after death, where we go, I am still unsure. I can say that I do believe in spirits, be they residual energy or actually ghosts, I don't know nor claim to know.
My belief is you go where you WANT to go when you die. If you wish to linger (as a spirit or whatever) you can. If you wish to reincarnate you can. If you believe in heaven, you can very well go there.
I am for euthanasia, I have actually had to practice it on a few of my beloved animals AS WELL as a few puppies/kittens. I never culled them, they were all humanely euthanized at the animal shelter. I have had to decide when enough was enough for a relative as well.
I am not afraid of death, the purpose of life ends in death. I personally believe that while abortion may end a life, that life "lost" will live on however it wants to, be it reincarnation, spirit, heaven, whatever.
I actually pity those who cannot embrace their eventual outcome, which is death. Death is nothing to be afraid of, it is going to happen to each and every one of us. But I digress, for it is not death anyone fears. We all know it is part of life. It is what comes AFTER death that we fear, because NONE of us really know. We can have FAITH that we will go to heaven or hell (if you believe that), we can believe that our spirit somehow lives on, we can believe that we will be reincarnated into the last tiger that will walk the earth. But we will never know, and that is what scares us.

I have no problems with a mercy killing, if that is what one wishes done. I know right now that I would want no heroic measures taken on me if I am declared brain-dead or severely disabled, such as no longer being able to feed or breathe or excrete on my own. I may still have brain function, but obviously what little function is left cannot even take care of the basic requirements for life. Much like an embryo or fetus. They have the INSTINCT to live, but can ANYONE say they CHOOSE to live? No. It sucks that abortion and mercy killings are around, but that is life. And life ALWAYS ends in death, be it abortion, a mercy killing, natural causes or homicide.
Abortion and mercy killings are not homicide. There is no malice behind a mercy killing, there is no DIRECT malice behind an abortion (meaning you may very well HATE that you are pregnant, but you don't necessarily HATE the being inside you, even if you never wanted children). When one goes and kills a person out of greed or anger, there is DIRECT malice behind that, therein lies the difference between homicide and abortion/mercy killing.
I equate abortion and mercy killing to nature. We humans are NOT above other animals, we are still animals, we just have higher intelligence than other species. Animals have communities, they communicate, they care for (and sometimes KILL) their young, they breed (some species, such as dolphins, actually even breed RECREATIONALLY), they build shelters, they die. Just like us. We, as humans, are actually one of the few species that does not regularly kill our born offspring (infanticide) because our offspring was sick, our nest was in a non-ideal location (some species of dormice will kill their babies because they see a cat lurking around), because we want control of the new pride, etc. We don't have the benefits of a kangaroo, who can hold her embryo in her body until conditions are right for her to parent. Abortion to me, is the human way of practicing what nature does in the wild. Only we are more humane about it, at least in my opinion. Never heard an embryo yowl in pain during an abortion, but I sure have heard a lion cub SCREAMING when the male decided to shred it to bits in order to gain control of the pride.

I, personally, believe in the afterlife. Gasp! I am sure I have just given more ammunition for being attacked, oh well... Anyway, I also believe if another wants to end their own life that is up to them. They are chosing that for themselves. I DO have a problem when someone else choses to end another human's life. I don't believe anyone has the right to make that decision for another and that belief has nothing to do with religion.

Depends on the person and how much he or she is suffering. I watched both of my parents gasp their last breath and if they had asked me to kill them cleanly and quickly, I would have. In fact, my parents' executer subtly accused me of overdosing mom on pain meds. The idea never occurred to me because she never asked for it but if she had, I would have done it.

We put animals down when they are suffering and there is no hope of life. Is human life so sacred that we should torture our loved ones, for our own selfish morality? I could have called my parents killers when I found out they put my cat to sleep when kidney failure struck her at sixteen years old.

We shoot horses when they break a leg, but we let suffering humans linger? If they are able to consciously ask for an end to it, people should be allowed to die with dignity and as little pain as possible.

The main reason I see your entire arguement as flawed Phenicks is this:
We all die in the end.

Its inescapable whether it happens due to abortion, miscarriage (why don't you have any issue with miscarriages?) are smothered as infants, die in a crash later.. doesn't matter.. we all die in the end.

Yes we all die but no one has a right to another person's life. The only life you have a right to take is your own. You also have the right to defend your mortality to the death if someone tries to kill you or in the cases of the government when someone is a threat to society. But smothering an infant, child, teenager, adult, senior citizen whoever, you should get the death penalty.

I DO have a problem with miscarriages which is why I donate to the march of dimes, miscarriages- like an fatal abnormality is a bad thing. But just as being handicapped isnt a crime, neither is having a miscarriage but it isnt the fault of the person who has it. And if they caused themselves to be handicapped or to have a miscarriage without hurting another born person- then that is their choice and their body to do with as they please. No harm no foul.

I'm confused, Phenicks. Are you pro-choice or pro-life? In another thread, you pretty much stated that abortion is A-OK in order to spare a man the horrors of unwanted child support, but now you're saying that the only life you have a right to take is your own. Did you mean "life" as in the lives of the born? If so, please be so kind as to clarify.

As usual Mother, you read into and distort what I have said. I am a nurse. I have no problem and actually encourage Living Wills, POA's and all other kinds of Advanced Directives. It is a great thing to be able to stipulate what you personally want done if you cannot make that decision yourself. I also don't really care if a person decides to commit suicide. That doesn't mean I condone it but he/she is choosing that for themselves. As for the terminally ill, there are many other options than physician assisted suicide but if that is what the individual chooses for him/herself, fine by me BUT I do not agree with any law mandating that I, personally, have to assist. Nope, I am not ok with the death penalty. The person involved usually doesn't agree with the his/her intentional death. When an unborn human agrees to be killed, then I will be all in agreement with abortion. Until then I see it as the intentially killing of another human being without their consent.

"I personally believe life starts at implantation when the embryo has a working blood supply but that is simply a belief and not something I could prove. Even so I still see abortion as a necessit because I think no one has a right to use your body for life support against your will, dead or alive.

Actually science would refute your belief. In most cases the woman is NOT pregnant against her will as it is her very action that created that life to begin with, hence she DID give permission for her body to be used as life support.

Actually, a woman usually (please note, I said usually)has no control over a miscarriage, that is nature. A woman usually has control over whether or not she has sex which sometimes results in pregnancy. After all that is what the human reproductive system does. Truthfully, according to insurance companies, you are somewhat at fault in a MVA due to the fact you were involved. You did not have to be in a vehicle therefore you are an accessory. You did not commit a criminal act because your intent was not to kill. As far as I know pregnancy is not a criminal act either but in most cases the women is a consenting active participant.
Could you please give some proof of your statement about science and sex.